4 ms·

The kind of situation(of identity loss and connectedness to nature ,etc) is kind of a goal in eastern meditation traditions. But another goal is creating compas

The kind of situation(of identity loss and connectedness to nature ,etc) is kind of a goal in eastern meditation traditions. But another goal is creating compassionate people who care about others while carrying that identity-less feeling with them. And true, one risk is that one would be happy with himself and isolate himself. But those traditions know and try to manage those risks. And i don't think this loss of self comes from self introspection, but more from long solitude(which tends to break the psych construct we call ego). And no wonder he like solitude so strongly - he didn't find happiness among humans before. Hopefully after he get released , he can find some way to make a living while having the ability to live mostly alone and in nature.

gambiting 12y ago
I've heard about jobs that would enable that - working at national parks, where you are given a job to do and have to spend weeks in the wilderness carrying it out - marking paths, taking pictures, fixing things - ideal path for someone who doesn't want human contact, as there will be very little of it. The only question is if he would get it with his, now criminal, record.
- jackgavigan 12y ago
  > I've heard about jobs that would enable that - working at national parks... Edward Abbey wrote about his experiences doing exactly this in Desert Solitaire.
  - keithflower 12y ago
    What did I do? There was nothing that had to be done. I listened to the voices, the many voices, vague, distant, but astonishingly human, the Havasu Creek. I heard the doors creak open, the doors creak shut, the old forgotten cabins where no one with tangible substance or the property of reflecting light ever entered, ever returned. I went native and dreamed away days on the shore of the pool under the waterfall, wandered naked as Adam under the cottonwoods, inspecting my cactus gardens. The days became wild, strange, ambiguous --- a sinister element pervaded the flow of time. I lived narcotic hours in which like the Taoist Chuang-tse I worried about butterflies and who was dreaming what. There was a serpent, a red racer, living in the rocks of the spring where I filled my canteens; he was always there, slipping among the stones or pausing to mesmerize me with his suggestive tongue and cloudly haunted primeval eyes. Damn his eyes. We got to know each other rather too well, I think. I agonized over the girls I had known and over those I hoped were yet to come. I slipped by degrees into lunacy, me and the moon, and lost to a certain extent the power to distinguish between what was and what was not myself looking at my hand, I would see a leaf trembling on a branch. A green leaf. I thought of Debussy, of Keats and Blake and Andrew Marvell. I remembered Tom O'Bedlam. And all of those lost and never remembered. Who would return? To be lost again? I went for walks. I went for walks, and on one of these, the last, I took in Havasu, regained everything that seemed to be ebbing away. -- Ed Abbey, Desert Solitaire http://www.hkhinc.com/arizona/havasu/articles/havasuabbey.htm http://www.hkhinc.com/arizona/havasu/articles/havasuabbey.ht...
r00fus 12y ago
> And true, one risk is that one would be happy with himself and isolate himself. But those traditions know and try to manage those risks. Sorry, at least in Indian mythology the "ascetic" is idolized and glorified (they exhibited superpowers through their isolated meditation). In what way is this "managing those risks"?
- pinkyand 12y ago
  You're right. My knowledge is about the Buddhist traditions.
- dhruval 12y ago
  Developing various cartoon superpowers is mostly used in the context of being denounced as being of inferior value compared to that tradition's idea of spiritual salvation. So I am not sure if that can be taken as promoting asceticism. Leaving mythology aside, different spiritual traditions strive towards different goals. Sikhism rejects outward asceticism... "Asceticism doesn't lie in the earring, nor in the shaven head, nor blowing a conch. Asceticism lies in remaining pure amidst impurities." Buddhism advocates a middle way, and is against too much asceticism as well as too much hedonism and in mahayana a vow working to benefit others... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva_vow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva_vow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way Hinduism is a very mixed bag. A one of the most popular ideals involves working towards outcome in a non-attached way... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_yoga http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_yoga Jainism probably has the most ascetic spiritual ideal among the indian traditions.

gambiting 12y ago

I've heard about jobs that would enable that - working at national parks, where you are given a job to do and have to spend weeks in the wilderness carrying it out - marking paths, taking pictures, fixing things - ideal path for someone who doesn't want human contact, as there will be very little of it. The only question is if he would get it with his, now criminal, record.

jackgavigan 12y ago
> I've heard about jobs that would enable that - working at national parks... Edward Abbey wrote about his experiences doing exactly this in Desert Solitaire.
- keithflower 12y ago
  What did I do? There was nothing that had to be done. I listened to the voices, the many voices, vague, distant, but astonishingly human, the Havasu Creek. I heard the doors creak open, the doors creak shut, the old forgotten cabins where no one with tangible substance or the property of reflecting light ever entered, ever returned. I went native and dreamed away days on the shore of the pool under the waterfall, wandered naked as Adam under the cottonwoods, inspecting my cactus gardens. The days became wild, strange, ambiguous --- a sinister element pervaded the flow of time. I lived narcotic hours in which like the Taoist Chuang-tse I worried about butterflies and who was dreaming what. There was a serpent, a red racer, living in the rocks of the spring where I filled my canteens; he was always there, slipping among the stones or pausing to mesmerize me with his suggestive tongue and cloudly haunted primeval eyes. Damn his eyes. We got to know each other rather too well, I think. I agonized over the girls I had known and over those I hoped were yet to come. I slipped by degrees into lunacy, me and the moon, and lost to a certain extent the power to distinguish between what was and what was not myself looking at my hand, I would see a leaf trembling on a branch. A green leaf. I thought of Debussy, of Keats and Blake and Andrew Marvell. I remembered Tom O'Bedlam. And all of those lost and never remembered. Who would return? To be lost again? I went for walks. I went for walks, and on one of these, the last, I took in Havasu, regained everything that seemed to be ebbing away. -- Ed Abbey, Desert Solitaire http://www.hkhinc.com/arizona/havasu/articles/havasuabbey.htm http://www.hkhinc.com/arizona/havasu/articles/havasuabbey.ht...

r00fus 12y ago

> And true, one risk is that one would be happy with himself and isolate himself. But those traditions know and try to manage those risks. Sorry, at least in Indian mythology the "ascetic" is idolized and glorified (they exhibited superpowers through their isolated meditation). In what way is this "managing those risks"?

pinkyand 12y ago
You're right. My knowledge is about the Buddhist traditions.
dhruval 12y ago
Developing various cartoon superpowers is mostly used in the context of being denounced as being of inferior value compared to that tradition's idea of spiritual salvation. So I am not sure if that can be taken as promoting asceticism. Leaving mythology aside, different spiritual traditions strive towards different goals. Sikhism rejects outward asceticism... "Asceticism doesn't lie in the earring, nor in the shaven head, nor blowing a conch. Asceticism lies in remaining pure amidst impurities." Buddhism advocates a middle way, and is against too much asceticism as well as too much hedonism and in mahayana a vow working to benefit others... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva_vow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva_vow http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way Hinduism is a very mixed bag. A one of the most popular ideals involves working towards outcome in a non-attached way... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_yoga http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_yoga Jainism probably has the most ascetic spiritual ideal among the indian traditions.