5 ms·

How Google Stole My $3800

5 points by estnon 12y ago

opless 12y ago
Sounds like the author was doing 'dodgy stuff', and you can probably bet that customers were likely compensated somehow.
lutusp 12y ago
Quote: "I was told that the reason [for being suspended from Google Play] was that I had been selling public domain books." This should have been the title of the submission.
- estnon 12y ago
  google play is full of public domain books. despite amazon and apple, there is no clear policy against it.
- readerrrr 12y ago
  I thought selling public domain content is legal.
  - dragonwriter 12y ago
    Sure. So what? That something is legal for you to do independently does not mean it is allowed by the Google Play terms.
    - readerrrr 12y ago
      I doubt there is anything in the terms that prohibits that.
    - estnon 12y ago
      even if a policy violation appears after over 6 months, that doesn't mean that google takes all the money on the table.
      - lutusp 12y ago
        Consider this from Google's position -- they see an activity that will make them look irresponsible or in collusion. To minimize damage to their reputation, they might want to stop the activity even if they can't fairly redistribute the ill-gotten gains afterward. Also, if legal authority decided to step in, Google would minimize their own liability and exposure by stopping the activity rather than by allowing it to continue. It also serves as a warning to others who might want to sell content they don't own -- it discourages a repetition of the same behavior.
  - lutusp 12y ago
    That depends on the details. Did the seller explain that he was selling free content? if there was any deception, then the crime is not in the sale, but in the method -- possible misrepresentation or fraud.
- DanBC 12y ago
  You don't know if it was deceptive or if there was some kind of value-add.
  - lutusp 12y ago
    True, but I think the original poster would have mentioned this if it were true. But consider -- how do you value-add a public domain work without getting into copyright problems? It's not as though he wrote a book of criticism or satire of existing works.
    - DanBC 12y ago
      > But consider -- how do you value-add a public domain work without getting into copyright problems? You curate them and offer collections based on theme. You typeset them carefully and print them on nice paper. You digitally typeset them and give them a carefully created CSS file.
miohtama 12y ago
.... and this is why people are excited about Bitcoin. Small business owners have really difficult negotiation position against big giants in the case there are any issues (and there always will be). (This regardless that the author clearly violated Google Play terms of service and Google allowed money accumulate to the persons account)
oliwarner 12y ago
Why are you telling us? Sue them and let the court decide whether they've stolen from you.
- fasteo 12y ago
  Strange question. This is what HN is all about. Telling histories that might be of interested to the community. This one is no exception.
Broken_Hippo 12y ago
I'm curios why the author went ahead and starting selling before he was able to receive payment? My personal 'stop' started there.
commentzorro 12y ago
Looks like Lemur Books is selling public domain Sherlock Holmes books. I'm guessing the value add is supposed to be nice format/layout on mobile devices but I can't be sure. If Lemur were clearly saying they were selling the layout and formatting of public domain books I'd side with the blog. However, if they were implying that they were selling the e-books as content w/o clearly stating these were public domain then I'd side with Google. I hate it when people build a sales campaign around tricking people, even if legal. What was the pitch in the play store?
- JohnTHaller 12y ago
  There is no requirement, legal or otherwise, to identify a physical book you sell in a bookstore as having content available in the public domain. Why would there be on an ebook?
  - commentzorro 12y ago
    The first paragraph stated what I found that the blog didn't make clear to me. i.e. what was he selling and why was his account suspended. Items the blog didn't mention. The second paragraph gave my opinion on the blog post (on which side I fall) and my reason for my opinion. Specifically point out that either way I didn't think they did anything illegal ... but possibly (not necessarily) immoral. The third paragraph asks anyone knows the details about how the sales pitch was worded in the play store.
- estnon 12y ago
  Obviously the post is not about if books are PD or not. Google has to completely delete all books and refund the customers, or pay publisher's royalty. It has no right to take all revenue. That is it. edit: btw, play store, conan doyle books right now: https://play.google.com/store/books/author?id=Arthur+Conan+Doyle https://play.google.com/store/books/author?id=Arthur+Conan+D...
nowayout 12y ago
Why is everybody too focused on the "public domain" part? I do not see any statement regarding the public domain books on Google Policies, unlike Amazon. https://support.google.com/books/partner/answer/166501?hl=en https://support.google.com/books/partner/answer/166501?hl=en https://kdp.amazon.com/help?topicId=A2OHLJURFVK57Q https://kdp.amazon.com/help?topicId=A2OHLJURFVK57Q Bookstores, not only the digital ones, are full of public domain books. What do we want here? Publishers not to publish those classics or to publish them but give them for free? Why is this any different for companies who fill empty pets with natural water and sell it to people? Isn't that public domain too? Don't they just wrap the "water"? Do they say that indeed they simply put the the free water in those fancy plastics? Beyond all my subjective views, there is one thing objective that it's not fair for Google to keep the money for themselves when there is no policy for it.

5 points by estnon 12y ago

Sounds like the author was doing 'dodgy stuff', and you can probably bet that customers were likely compensated somehow.

lutusp 12y ago

Quote: "I was told that the reason [for being suspended from Google Play] was that I had been selling public domain books." This should have been the title of the submission.

estnon 12y ago
google play is full of public domain books. despite amazon and apple, there is no clear policy against it.
readerrrr 12y ago
I thought selling public domain content is legal.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  Sure. So what? That something is legal for you to do independently does not mean it is allowed by the Google Play terms.
  - readerrrr 12y ago
    I doubt there is anything in the terms that prohibits that.
  - estnon 12y ago
    even if a policy violation appears after over 6 months, that doesn't mean that google takes all the money on the table.
    - lutusp 12y ago
      Consider this from Google's position -- they see an activity that will make them look irresponsible or in collusion. To minimize damage to their reputation, they might want to stop the activity even if they can't fairly redistribute the ill-gotten gains afterward. Also, if legal authority decided to step in, Google would minimize their own liability and exposure by stopping the activity rather than by allowing it to continue. It also serves as a warning to others who might want to sell content they don't own -- it discourages a repetition of the same behavior.
- lutusp 12y ago
  That depends on the details. Did the seller explain that he was selling free content? if there was any deception, then the crime is not in the sale, but in the method -- possible misrepresentation or fraud.
DanBC 12y ago
You don't know if it was deceptive or if there was some kind of value-add.
- lutusp 12y ago
  True, but I think the original poster would have mentioned this if it were true. But consider -- how do you value-add a public domain work without getting into copyright problems? It's not as though he wrote a book of criticism or satire of existing works.
  - DanBC 12y ago
    > But consider -- how do you value-add a public domain work without getting into copyright problems? You curate them and offer collections based on theme. You typeset them carefully and print them on nice paper. You digitally typeset them and give them a carefully created CSS file.

miohtama 12y ago

.... and this is why people are excited about Bitcoin. Small business owners have really difficult negotiation position against big giants in the case there are any issues (and there always will be). (This regardless that the author clearly violated Google Play terms of service and Google allowed money accumulate to the persons account)

oliwarner 12y ago

Why are you telling us? Sue them and let the court decide whether they've stolen from you.

fasteo 12y ago
Strange question. This is what HN is all about. Telling histories that might be of interested to the community. This one is no exception.

Broken_Hippo 12y ago

I'm curios why the author went ahead and starting selling before he was able to receive payment? My personal 'stop' started there.

commentzorro 12y ago

Looks like Lemur Books is selling public domain Sherlock Holmes books. I'm guessing the value add is supposed to be nice format/layout on mobile devices but I can't be sure. If Lemur were clearly saying they were selling the layout and formatting of public domain books I'd side with the blog. However, if they were implying that they were selling the e-books as content w/o clearly stating these were public domain then I'd side with Google. I hate it when people build a sales campaign around tricking people, even if legal. What was the pitch in the play store?

JohnTHaller 12y ago
There is no requirement, legal or otherwise, to identify a physical book you sell in a bookstore as having content available in the public domain. Why would there be on an ebook?
- commentzorro 12y ago
  The first paragraph stated what I found that the blog didn't make clear to me. i.e. what was he selling and why was his account suspended. Items the blog didn't mention. The second paragraph gave my opinion on the blog post (on which side I fall) and my reason for my opinion. Specifically point out that either way I didn't think they did anything illegal ... but possibly (not necessarily) immoral. The third paragraph asks anyone knows the details about how the sales pitch was worded in the play store.
estnon 12y ago
Obviously the post is not about if books are PD or not. Google has to completely delete all books and refund the customers, or pay publisher's royalty. It has no right to take all revenue. That is it. edit: btw, play store, conan doyle books right now: https://play.google.com/store/books/author?id=Arthur+Conan+Doyle https://play.google.com/store/books/author?id=Arthur+Conan+D...

nowayout 12y ago

Why is everybody too focused on the "public domain" part? I do not see any statement regarding the public domain books on Google Policies, unlike Amazon. https://support.google.com/books/partner/answer/166501?hl=en https://support.google.com/books/partner/answer/166501?hl=en https://kdp.amazon.com/help?topicId=A2OHLJURFVK57Q https://kdp.amazon.com/help?topicId=A2OHLJURFVK57Q Bookstores, not only the digital ones, are full of public domain books. What do we want here? Publishers not to publish those classics or to publish them but give them for free? Why is this any different for companies who fill empty pets with natural water and sell it to people? Isn't that public domain too? Don't they just wrap the "water"? Do they say that indeed they simply put the the free water in those fancy plastics? Beyond all my subjective views, there is one thing objective that it's not fair for Google to keep the money for themselves when there is no policy for it.