8 ms·

Coders at work is finally available

137 points by oscardelben 17y ago

DanielStraight 17y ago
Awesome. I'm pre-ordering the second I get home from work... or maybe during lunch.
- apgwoz 17y ago
  There's no reason to pre-order, since it was released today. I did pre-order last week, and Amazon told me it'd be shipped on the 15th, sigh.
  - mhb 17y ago
    Except that Amazon still shows it as pre-order (10:09 AM EST).
    - gigamonkey 17y ago
      It has now switched from "Pre-order" to "Add to Shopping Cart". edit: And then they switched it back. Grrrr.
      - mncaudill 17y ago
        It's up for me now. Looking forward to reading the book, Peter.
Maro 17y ago
Funny, it was also pirated today. (I have an RSS watch for "darksiderg" on Mininova.)
- Maro 17y ago
  To all the downvoters: Guess what, I live in Eastern Europe, so I can't go to the local bookstore to flip through books. English language books (most good stuff written today) doesn't get imported at all. Books that are popular in the US are translated (terrible for technical books) about 5-10 years after their original release date. So guess what, I download the books, look at them, and order the good ones (about 5 every few months) from Amazon and Alibris.
  - jacquesm 17y ago
    I think the downvotes may have something to do with the fact that you gave a bunch of information that make it very easy for others to download the book as well. Effectively you have probably cost the author a bunch of potential sales.
    - deleted 17y ago
      [deleted]
  - gjm11 17y ago
    That's a pretty good justification for your grabbing a pirated copy, but that doesn't have much bearing on whether your comment was valuable. A downvote for your original comment is (I hope) a judgement about the value of your comment, not about your moral character.
    - Maro 17y ago
      The intended purpose of my comment was to highlight the following anecdote: it seems that books are pirated the day they come out, which is already pretty usual for movies and software, but, to my knowledge, not for books. Cheers!
  - GeneralMaximus 17y ago
    I feel your pain :( Here in India, I can only purchase a few selected O'Reilly titles, for which I have to travel across the city. Apress, Wrox, Packt are all available somewhere, but I still haven't found an accessible (read: near a Metro line) retail outlet that keeps those books.
amix 17y ago
I wish it was possible to buy a PDF version.
- jsteele 17y ago
  I believe the ebook option at http://apress.com/book/view/1430219483 http://apress.com/book/view/1430219483 is a PDF.
  - minsight 17y ago
    It is. I've been reading it during my commute (it's ok - it's by train!) for the last week.
  - vsync 17y ago
    I went there literally ready to punch in the CC#. But $21?! I might as well pay the extra $9 and have a nice physical artifact to show for it.
    - philips 17y ago
      Or you can save a dollar and get the hardback from Amazon. O'Reilly is having the same issue setting prices for their eBooks against Amazon[1]. [1] http://getsatisfaction.com/oreilly/topics/amazon_hardcopy_is_cheaper_than_ebook http://getsatisfaction.com/oreilly/topics/amazon_hardcopy_is...
- deleted 17y ago
  [deleted]
mapleoin 17y ago
Masterminds of Programming[0] is another cool book on the subject. [0] http://oreilly.com/catalog/9780596515171/ http://oreilly.com/catalog/9780596515171/
- Kaizyn 17y ago
  Yes, this was a really good book. I suspect that Coders at Work will be a little better though because the interviewer(s) in Masterminds seemed a bit weak and not really able to keep up with the interviewees in the discussions.
- Kaizyn 17y ago
  Yes, this was a really good book. I suspect that Coders at Work will be a little better though because the interviewer(s) in Masterminds seemed a bit weak in places and not really able to keep up with the interviewees in the discussions.
- 10ren 17y ago
  Some discussion here http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583164 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583164
- 10ren 17y ago
  "Secrets of the Rockstar Programmers: Riding the IT Crest " http://ridingthecrest.com/ http://ridingthecrest.com/ I think that completes the entire coder-interview genre.
ssn 17y ago
No sample/preview chapter?
amichail 17y ago
Only two in the list are women. However, one could argue that almost all programmers will be women in the far future. That's because as AI becomes more sophisticated, programming will become more like teaching. And teaching is something that mostly interests women today.
- cousin_it 17y ago
  It's pretty funny. If we accept your assumptions, we can conclude that most programmers in the far future will be AIs. No idea if those AIs will be male or female; more wild speculation is always welcome.
  - amichail 17y ago
    What if the AI were like a human child in intelligence? In that case, it would not be capable of teaching/programming at a high level of sophistication.
    - cousin_it 17y ago
      That's a pretty scary mental image: a caring woman teaches a tender childlike AI for its boring future job as an ERP system. Perhaps we should rethink the plan.
    - jacquesm 17y ago
      I think I'm beginning to see where your bias sits. It would appear that in your mind the people that take care of children are 'all women' and that therefore a 'young ai' will be dealt with exclusively by women until they are old enough to go into the real world. May I ask you what your cultural background is ?
      - amichail 17y ago
        May I ask you what your cultural background is ? No.
        17y ago
axod 17y ago
>> "Crockford is, by nature, a simplifier and a tidier. He invented JSON, the data interchange format widely used in Ajax applications" Does anyone else find it irritating to read "He invented JSON", which isn't true at all? He popularized and called out JSON which already existed.
- cturner 17y ago
  Perhaps 'discovered' or 'isolated' would be a better. It's the sort of thing that's unusual in computing but common in natural science. Something that's all around us, but we don't realise how to access it until someone comes along and componentises it for us. (The key quality of JSON for my perspective is that was a form that was immediately usable across several languages which already existed.)
- markkanof 17y ago
  Crockford actually makes the explicit distinction that he discovered JSON vs inventing it in a presentation he gave called "The JSON Saga". http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/video.php?v=crockford-json http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/video.php?v=crockford... It seems like other people often say that he invented it, even though he doesn't say that.
jasonkester 17y ago
Founders at Work is one of those books that I keep finding myself re-reading over and over. There is so much good stuff there. For some reason, the description of this book just doesn't inspire me to read it. It's hard to articulate why that is, since it's in the same style as Founders, and it interviews a similar set of people. Maybe it's just that I've heard enough from that generation of programmers. Maybe I've just heard enough from all programmers. Maybe, talking about programming is simply not interesting at all. I don't know. Tell me about how you launched a billion dollar company from your apartment with stolen office chairs and I'm there. Tell me how you really like pointers, and I sort of lose interest.
- mncaudill 17y ago
  Different strokes for different folks, my man. The business-oriented people can read Founders, the technical-minded people can read can read Coders, and then the intersection of the two can read both! I personally find the idea of this book to be fascinating and pre-ordered it a couple of weeks ago.
  - ionfish 17y ago
    > [T]he union of the two can read both! Don't you mean the intersection of the two?
    - mncaudill 17y ago
      Good catch--I edited it to correct the wrongness. Fingers going faster than the brain on a Friday morning...
- axod 17y ago
  Yeah I feel similar. Programming isn't that hard :/ Building a successful startup, selling stuff, getting investment etc etc - They seem orders of magnitude harder than programming.
  - mncaudill 17y ago
jeremyw 17y ago
It's a crime this isn't on the Kindle. A book about hackers? When I emailed the author, he was not so interested. Books I bought for the Kindle last quarter: 20. Books I bought on paper: 0. Update: It's also hasn't been submitted for Amazon Search Inside scanning or Google Book Search. If authors retain their digital rights, they can submit to both (plus Kindle) services quite easily from a variety of source formats -- circumventing ancient publisher pipelines. Alas.
- unalone 17y ago
  I wouldn't consider buying this without a Kindle option. For me it's not worth the bulk, but a digital option would be welcome.
  - keyist 17y ago
    > GP: It's a crime this isn't on the Kindle. > I wouldn't consider buying this without a Kindle option. I completely don't grok how you could use delivery mechanism as the sole criteria for passing up on knowledge. It's a book for crying out loud, not some giant machine that takes up half a room. EDIT: bad assumption, consider the above more a reply to GP than parent. That said I am always bemused by disdain for physical books. If you worry about bulk you can always read it then resell it or give it away. For books deemed worthy, the knowledge gained is well worth the sticker price even if you don't end up keeping it.
    - unalone 17y ago
      There is more knowledge available in front of me at the moment than I can ever digest. I have several months of music which I haven't heard yet and never will hear. I've got a gigabyte in text of unread literature. There are a hundred million blogs and papers that I've wanted to read but haven't found time for yet, and I want to reread all the things I have read. Coders At Work barely appeals to me. If I could easily get it, I would think about it, since there's no risk to Kindle purchases. On the other hand: In my room right now I have a total of five books, which have been carefully selected as the only books I felt were worth bringing with me, so that when I move out I don't need to worry about having lost a thing. Coders At Work doesn't deserve to be mentioned alongside those five books, and it will not have a place in my room unless it's digitized and e-paper'd.
deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
jamesbritt 17y ago
In searching for the book on Amazon I found this: http://www.amazon.com/Land-Lisp-Learn-Program-Game/dp/1593272006/ http://www.amazon.com/Land-Lisp-Learn-Program-Game/dp/159327... Sweet.
antirez 17y ago
Too much old / academia guys for my tastes. Underground / modern programming is a different kind of culture.
- antipaganda 17y ago
  Ah, young padawan. How cute.
10ren 17y ago
Re Knuth: "A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that worked." - Gall's Law - Tesla claimed that he could envisage an entire complex machine (and run it, so he could watch which parts wear out), without experimenting or prototyping or designing anything - as a contrast to Edison. - Henri Poincaré claimed that complex new insights came to him fully formed (after immersing himself in their details), from his unconscious. Re Simon Peyton Jones: Functional programming is the future of imperative programming and always will be.

137 points by oscardelben 17y ago

DanielStraight 17y ago

Awesome. I'm pre-ordering the second I get home from work... or maybe during lunch.

apgwoz 17y ago
There's no reason to pre-order, since it was released today. I did pre-order last week, and Amazon told me it'd be shipped on the 15th, sigh.
- mhb 17y ago
  Except that Amazon still shows it as pre-order (10:09 AM EST).
  - gigamonkey 17y ago
    It has now switched from "Pre-order" to "Add to Shopping Cart". edit: And then they switched it back. Grrrr.
    - mncaudill 17y ago
      It's up for me now. Looking forward to reading the book, Peter.

Maro 17y ago

Funny, it was also pirated today. (I have an RSS watch for "darksiderg" on Mininova.)

Maro 17y ago
To all the downvoters: Guess what, I live in Eastern Europe, so I can't go to the local bookstore to flip through books. English language books (most good stuff written today) doesn't get imported at all. Books that are popular in the US are translated (terrible for technical books) about 5-10 years after their original release date. So guess what, I download the books, look at them, and order the good ones (about 5 every few months) from Amazon and Alibris.
- jacquesm 17y ago
  I think the downvotes may have something to do with the fact that you gave a bunch of information that make it very easy for others to download the book as well. Effectively you have probably cost the author a bunch of potential sales.
  - deleted 17y ago
    [deleted]
- gjm11 17y ago
  That's a pretty good justification for your grabbing a pirated copy, but that doesn't have much bearing on whether your comment was valuable. A downvote for your original comment is (I hope) a judgement about the value of your comment, not about your moral character.
  - Maro 17y ago
    The intended purpose of my comment was to highlight the following anecdote: it seems that books are pirated the day they come out, which is already pretty usual for movies and software, but, to my knowledge, not for books. Cheers!
- GeneralMaximus 17y ago
  I feel your pain :( Here in India, I can only purchase a few selected O'Reilly titles, for which I have to travel across the city. Apress, Wrox, Packt are all available somewhere, but I still haven't found an accessible (read: near a Metro line) retail outlet that keeps those books.

amix 17y ago

I wish it was possible to buy a PDF version.

jsteele 17y ago
I believe the ebook option at http://apress.com/book/view/1430219483 http://apress.com/book/view/1430219483 is a PDF.
- minsight 17y ago
  It is. I've been reading it during my commute (it's ok - it's by train!) for the last week.
- vsync 17y ago
  I went there literally ready to punch in the CC#. But $21?! I might as well pay the extra $9 and have a nice physical artifact to show for it.
  - philips 17y ago
    Or you can save a dollar and get the hardback from Amazon. O'Reilly is having the same issue setting prices for their eBooks against Amazon[1]. [1] http://getsatisfaction.com/oreilly/topics/amazon_hardcopy_is_cheaper_than_ebook http://getsatisfaction.com/oreilly/topics/amazon_hardcopy_is...
deleted 17y ago
[deleted]

mapleoin 17y ago

Masterminds of Programming[0] is another cool book on the subject. [0] http://oreilly.com/catalog/9780596515171/ http://oreilly.com/catalog/9780596515171/

Kaizyn 17y ago
Yes, this was a really good book. I suspect that Coders at Work will be a little better though because the interviewer(s) in Masterminds seemed a bit weak and not really able to keep up with the interviewees in the discussions.
Kaizyn 17y ago
Yes, this was a really good book. I suspect that Coders at Work will be a little better though because the interviewer(s) in Masterminds seemed a bit weak in places and not really able to keep up with the interviewees in the discussions.
10ren 17y ago
Some discussion here http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583164 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=583164
10ren 17y ago
"Secrets of the Rockstar Programmers: Riding the IT Crest " http://ridingthecrest.com/ http://ridingthecrest.com/ I think that completes the entire coder-interview genre.

ssn 17y ago

No sample/preview chapter?

amichail 17y ago

Only two in the list are women. However, one could argue that almost all programmers will be women in the far future. That's because as AI becomes more sophisticated, programming will become more like teaching. And teaching is something that mostly interests women today.

cousin_it 17y ago
It's pretty funny. If we accept your assumptions, we can conclude that most programmers in the far future will be AIs. No idea if those AIs will be male or female; more wild speculation is always welcome.
- amichail 17y ago
  What if the AI were like a human child in intelligence? In that case, it would not be capable of teaching/programming at a high level of sophistication.
  - cousin_it 17y ago
    That's a pretty scary mental image: a caring woman teaches a tender childlike AI for its boring future job as an ERP system. Perhaps we should rethink the plan.
  - jacquesm 17y ago
    I think I'm beginning to see where your bias sits. It would appear that in your mind the people that take care of children are 'all women' and that therefore a 'young ai' will be dealt with exclusively by women until they are old enough to go into the real world. May I ask you what your cultural background is ?
    - amichail 17y ago
      May I ask you what your cultural background is ? No.
      - 17y ago

axod 17y ago

>> "Crockford is, by nature, a simplifier and a tidier. He invented JSON, the data interchange format widely used in Ajax applications" Does anyone else find it irritating to read "He invented JSON", which isn't true at all? He popularized and called out JSON which already existed.

cturner 17y ago
Perhaps 'discovered' or 'isolated' would be a better. It's the sort of thing that's unusual in computing but common in natural science. Something that's all around us, but we don't realise how to access it until someone comes along and componentises it for us. (The key quality of JSON for my perspective is that was a form that was immediately usable across several languages which already existed.)
markkanof 17y ago
Crockford actually makes the explicit distinction that he discovered JSON vs inventing it in a presentation he gave called "The JSON Saga". http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/video.php?v=crockford-json http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/video.php?v=crockford... It seems like other people often say that he invented it, even though he doesn't say that.

jasonkester 17y ago

Founders at Work is one of those books that I keep finding myself re-reading over and over. There is so much good stuff there. For some reason, the description of this book just doesn't inspire me to read it. It's hard to articulate why that is, since it's in the same style as Founders, and it interviews a similar set of people. Maybe it's just that I've heard enough from that generation of programmers. Maybe I've just heard enough from all programmers. Maybe, talking about programming is simply not interesting at all. I don't know. Tell me about how you launched a billion dollar company from your apartment with stolen office chairs and I'm there. Tell me how you really like pointers, and I sort of lose interest.

mncaudill 17y ago
Different strokes for different folks, my man. The business-oriented people can read Founders, the technical-minded people can read can read Coders, and then the intersection of the two can read both! I personally find the idea of this book to be fascinating and pre-ordered it a couple of weeks ago.
- ionfish 17y ago
  > [T]he union of the two can read both! Don't you mean the intersection of the two?
  - mncaudill 17y ago
    Good catch--I edited it to correct the wrongness. Fingers going faster than the brain on a Friday morning...
axod 17y ago
Yeah I feel similar. Programming isn't that hard :/ Building a successful startup, selling stuff, getting investment etc etc - They seem orders of magnitude harder than programming.
- mncaudill 17y ago

jeremyw 17y ago

It's a crime this isn't on the Kindle. A book about hackers? When I emailed the author, he was not so interested. Books I bought for the Kindle last quarter: 20. Books I bought on paper: 0. Update: It's also hasn't been submitted for Amazon Search Inside scanning or Google Book Search. If authors retain their digital rights, they can submit to both (plus Kindle) services quite easily from a variety of source formats -- circumventing ancient publisher pipelines. Alas.

unalone 17y ago
I wouldn't consider buying this without a Kindle option. For me it's not worth the bulk, but a digital option would be welcome.
- keyist 17y ago
  > GP: It's a crime this isn't on the Kindle. > I wouldn't consider buying this without a Kindle option. I completely don't grok how you could use delivery mechanism as the sole criteria for passing up on knowledge. It's a book for crying out loud, not some giant machine that takes up half a room. EDIT: bad assumption, consider the above more a reply to GP than parent. That said I am always bemused by disdain for physical books. If you worry about bulk you can always read it then resell it or give it away. For books deemed worthy, the knowledge gained is well worth the sticker price even if you don't end up keeping it.
  - unalone 17y ago
    There is more knowledge available in front of me at the moment than I can ever digest. I have several months of music which I haven't heard yet and never will hear. I've got a gigabyte in text of unread literature. There are a hundred million blogs and papers that I've wanted to read but haven't found time for yet, and I want to reread all the things I have read. Coders At Work barely appeals to me. If I could easily get it, I would think about it, since there's no risk to Kindle purchases. On the other hand: In my room right now I have a total of five books, which have been carefully selected as the only books I felt were worth bringing with me, so that when I move out I don't need to worry about having lost a thing. Coders At Work doesn't deserve to be mentioned alongside those five books, and it will not have a place in my room unless it's digitized and e-paper'd.

deleted 17y ago

[deleted]

jamesbritt 17y ago

In searching for the book on Amazon I found this: http://www.amazon.com/Land-Lisp-Learn-Program-Game/dp/1593272006/ http://www.amazon.com/Land-Lisp-Learn-Program-Game/dp/159327... Sweet.

antirez 17y ago

Too much old / academia guys for my tastes. Underground / modern programming is a different kind of culture.

antipaganda 17y ago
Ah, young padawan. How cute.

10ren 17y ago

Re Knuth: "A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that worked." - Gall's Law - Tesla claimed that he could envisage an entire complex machine (and run it, so he could watch which parts wear out), without experimenting or prototyping or designing anything - as a contrast to Edison. - Henri Poincaré claimed that complex new insights came to him fully formed (after immersing himself in their details), from his unconscious. Re Simon Peyton Jones: Functional programming is the future of imperative programming and always will be.