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The Artists sure made a statement! The truly wonderful part of this action is that the statement they made was perhaps not the one they intended. New Yorker's

The Artists sure made a statement! The truly wonderful part of this action is that the statement they made was perhaps not the one they intended. New Yorker's sensitivities aside, this beautifully demonstrated how bat-shit crazy the govt. & the media has become over terrorism fears. The NYPD did initially consider this to be an art-project [1]...and had they let it go at that, things would have been much less embarrassing now. So an unlikely pair of Germans (allegedly) deserve kudos for exposing the American scardey-cat responses & massive waste of resources and time that can be brought about by simple (but unusual) things. [1] http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/22/us/new-york-brooklyn-bridge-flags/ http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/22/us/new-york-brooklyn-bridge-fl...

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dmix 12y ago
This quote from the artists summed up the parallel nicely: > “We saw the bridge, which was designed by a German, trained in Berlin, who came to America because it was the place to fulfill his dreams, as the most beautiful expression of a great public space,” Mr. Leinkauf said. “That beauty was what we were trying to capture.” Then by effect they captured the beauty of the modern paranoid state where acts of vandalism spark mass-fear among the administrators - fear that they somehow aren't maintaining total control. This is the new nature of public spaces in New York. They are now primarily security zones, not avenues for creativity.
- this_user 12y ago
  > "Then by effect they captured the beauty of the modern paranoid state where acts of vandalism spark mass-fear among the administrators - fear that they somehow aren't maintaining total control." IMO this only goes to show that the real terrorists have actually won. They knew they could never achieve victory in a direct confrontation, but they managed to make a country destroy itself by sacrificing its own values over paranoia. I do wonder if that was their real plan all along or if they themselves were surprised by how well it worked.
  - dublinben 12y ago
    One of Bin Laden's stated goals[0] was to bankrupt the United States. All the money we've spent on foreign wars and 'homeland security' since 2001 has certainly come close. [0]http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/ http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/
    - wavefunction 12y ago
      That's mostly just a transfer of wealth from the middle class to the wealthy via defense contracting.
- look_lookatme 12y ago
  Millions of people enjoy unfettered access to public spaces in NYC a year. You can often walk the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridges anytime, 24 hours a day and never see a cop. You are completely free to drive both of them, checkpoint-free, even. There are protocols for art installations in the parks and there are innumerable private art spaces in NYC. But, barring, you know, scaling the Brooklyn Bridge towers and removing city property, there is plenty of room to make your case in the parks if it doesn't encroach on others.
  - dmix 12y ago
    > You can often walk the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridges anytime, 24 hours a day and never see a cop. This is how it should be, but that is hardly the reaction of the media and security agencies. The suitable reaction should be that it was an anomaly, a harmless prank. Not something society condones - since it was not done in a sanctioned park - but not something that should cause a hysteria because every public space doesn't have 100% security. Paranoia feeds into paranoia. These security systems are never minimizing in size, only expanding due to reactionary policy. This is the type of thing that squeezes both freedom and creativity from society, two things that are heavily intertwined and interdependent.
- enraged_camel 12y ago
  I agree with your general sentiment, but I think this specific case is simply a tragedy of politics, specifically of someone higher up not wanting to appear "soft on crime" and therefore ordering their army of underlings to perform a full-blown investigation that lasted for what... days? weeks? I really, really doubt that the individual police officers and investigators actually wanted to deal with this nonsense.
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- megablast 12y ago
  Well, what are you trying to say? Could they care less, or could they not care less?
- peterashford 12y ago
  Wow. That's really obnoxious. All human beings should care about what other people think. Ignorance of other's thoughts and feelings isn't something to be proud of. Disclaimer: neither European nor US citizen.
  - wavefunction 12y ago
    The person you're replying to doesn't know what they're talking about, though I will admit they are expressing a relatively common chauvinism among US conservatives that they exhibit instead of intelligent dialog. They're the same sort of person that thinks renaming "french fries" to "freedom fries" is some sort of rare genius.
    - deleted 12y ago
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- peterashford 12y ago
  "We should let Russia take a bit of Europe and buy the rest for pennies on the dollar." You do realise that the EU is a larger economy than the US, right?
fauigerzigerk 12y ago
What I find astonishing though is how the artists did not intend or even anticipate any of what you describe (if they're telling the truth). And that, I think, is not a sign of any transatlantic cultural gap. It's an intellectual failure on the part of the artists. Artists are supposed to be experts in symbolism and perception. In my view, what makes some art interesting is the tension between expectations and perception. To play with that, you have to be aware of the way in which your art will be perceived by others. I'm not saying that artists should never be surprised. But how can anyone be surprised about a white flag being interpreted as a sign of surrender? How can anyone be surprised that any modification of a nation's flag will be seen by some as malevolent defacement and an attack on that nation? I'm not saying it shouldn't be done. I'm just saying that "oops, we never thought this could be seen as anti-american" is an embarrassing statement to make if it comes from artists whose art is meant to be seen by the general public as opposed to some small circle of insiders visiting a gallery.

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dmix 12y ago

This quote from the artists summed up the parallel nicely: > “We saw the bridge, which was designed by a German, trained in Berlin, who came to America because it was the place to fulfill his dreams, as the most beautiful expression of a great public space,” Mr. Leinkauf said. “That beauty was what we were trying to capture.” Then by effect they captured the beauty of the modern paranoid state where acts of vandalism spark mass-fear among the administrators - fear that they somehow aren't maintaining total control. This is the new nature of public spaces in New York. They are now primarily security zones, not avenues for creativity.

this_user 12y ago
> "Then by effect they captured the beauty of the modern paranoid state where acts of vandalism spark mass-fear among the administrators - fear that they somehow aren't maintaining total control." IMO this only goes to show that the real terrorists have actually won. They knew they could never achieve victory in a direct confrontation, but they managed to make a country destroy itself by sacrificing its own values over paranoia. I do wonder if that was their real plan all along or if they themselves were surprised by how well it worked.
- dublinben 12y ago
  One of Bin Laden's stated goals[0] was to bankrupt the United States. All the money we've spent on foreign wars and 'homeland security' since 2001 has certainly come close. [0]http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/ http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/
  - wavefunction 12y ago
    That's mostly just a transfer of wealth from the middle class to the wealthy via defense contracting.
look_lookatme 12y ago
Millions of people enjoy unfettered access to public spaces in NYC a year. You can often walk the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridges anytime, 24 hours a day and never see a cop. You are completely free to drive both of them, checkpoint-free, even. There are protocols for art installations in the parks and there are innumerable private art spaces in NYC. But, barring, you know, scaling the Brooklyn Bridge towers and removing city property, there is plenty of room to make your case in the parks if it doesn't encroach on others.
- dmix 12y ago
  > You can often walk the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridges anytime, 24 hours a day and never see a cop. This is how it should be, but that is hardly the reaction of the media and security agencies. The suitable reaction should be that it was an anomaly, a harmless prank. Not something society condones - since it was not done in a sanctioned park - but not something that should cause a hysteria because every public space doesn't have 100% security. Paranoia feeds into paranoia. These security systems are never minimizing in size, only expanding due to reactionary policy. This is the type of thing that squeezes both freedom and creativity from society, two things that are heavily intertwined and interdependent.
enraged_camel 12y ago
I agree with your general sentiment, but I think this specific case is simply a tragedy of politics, specifically of someone higher up not wanting to appear "soft on crime" and therefore ordering their army of underlings to perform a full-blown investigation that lasted for what... days? weeks? I really, really doubt that the individual police officers and investigators actually wanted to deal with this nonsense.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

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megablast 12y ago
Well, what are you trying to say? Could they care less, or could they not care less?
peterashford 12y ago
Wow. That's really obnoxious. All human beings should care about what other people think. Ignorance of other's thoughts and feelings isn't something to be proud of. Disclaimer: neither European nor US citizen.
- wavefunction 12y ago
  The person you're replying to doesn't know what they're talking about, though I will admit they are expressing a relatively common chauvinism among US conservatives that they exhibit instead of intelligent dialog. They're the same sort of person that thinks renaming "french fries" to "freedom fries" is some sort of rare genius.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
peterashford 12y ago
"We should let Russia take a bit of Europe and buy the rest for pennies on the dollar." You do realise that the EU is a larger economy than the US, right?

fauigerzigerk 12y ago

What I find astonishing though is how the artists did not intend or even anticipate any of what you describe (if they're telling the truth). And that, I think, is not a sign of any transatlantic cultural gap. It's an intellectual failure on the part of the artists. Artists are supposed to be experts in symbolism and perception. In my view, what makes some art interesting is the tension between expectations and perception. To play with that, you have to be aware of the way in which your art will be perceived by others. I'm not saying that artists should never be surprised. But how can anyone be surprised about a white flag being interpreted as a sign of surrender? How can anyone be surprised that any modification of a nation's flag will be seen by some as malevolent defacement and an attack on that nation? I'm not saying it shouldn't be done. I'm just saying that "oops, we never thought this could be seen as anti-american" is an embarrassing statement to make if it comes from artists whose art is meant to be seen by the general public as opposed to some small circle of insiders visiting a gallery.