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You started down the right road. Much of their pay has to do with how they are paid. There are trucking companies that don't pay drivers to fuel the truck. Do y

You started down the right road. Much of their pay has to do with how they are paid. There are trucking companies that don't pay drivers to fuel the truck. Do you know how long that takes? It isn't like it is an optional task - that truck won't move without fuel. I know a driver who spends 2-6 hours waiting to be unloaded. He doesn't get paid for that time but isn't free to leave the truck because when the loading dock is ready for him he needs to be there to move the truck. How is that not being "on call"? If he wasn't working he could go catch a movie or dinner, sleep or whatever, but for some reason the law says it is OK to make him sit without pay to do his job.

tombrossman 12y ago
The issue is that most drivers incorrectly assume they are in the weakest position for any given scenario. They absorb delays as if it were their own fault and falsify logs to compensate. Many drivers even absorbed the reimbursable toll costs on a route because they couldn't match the ticket times to their falsified logs. They are afraid to log as 'on duty not driving', which is how they legally should be doing it. Sure, they make less that one day but the sheer number of hours wasted at the shipper or consignee will have a knock-on effect which will make on-time delivery less likely. I drove tractor-trailers in the US for eight years and I would tell other drivers 'this system is broken, allow it to fail and cover your ass by documenting everything'. I refused to falsify my logs and would rigidly log everything 100% accurately, even logging Hours of Service violations (e.g. difficulty finding parking & going 30-45 min over on drive time) which could have cost me a ticket. Once in a while I'd get hauled into a weigh station for an inspection and they'd notice the hours violation. I explained about refusing to falsify and they'd see this was true. I'd get a funny look but never a ticket. The outcome here was that I was very predictable to the 'trip planners', who were one grade above the lowly dispatchers. The trip planners always knew exactly where I stood from the truck's telemetry data, plus I would always communicate delays. They were better able to predict how to use my time and their company truck. I was never out of pocket for reimbursable expenses because time/date stamps on receipts always matched. I was making more than most of our company-employed drivers and even some of the owner-operators who struggled with fuel costs, etc. The dispatchers hated me because they constantly had to explain to management why my loads were late and how I could not be blamed for the delays as I had documented everything and communicated the delays well in advance. Every other driver would have gone over their hours illegally to compensate, but I always stopped when I ran out of driving hours and therefore missed appointments. They all caught on after a while and learned to use my time more wisely. I reliably made $50-55K/year which was exceptional for trucking and enjoyed the very low tax rate Hours of Service workers get (9%, taking the standard deduction x days worked, typically). It was an interesting job overall because of all the sights you see, but I can't recommend it to anyone looking for a career change. Stick with the tech sector as it is much safer and you can go home every night.
- npunt 12y ago
  thanks for sharing your experience, it sounds like a tough job just to do the job right. do you think the system will get un-broken before we start seeing things like automated trucks? http://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775482/why-trucks-will-drive-themselves-before-cars-do http://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775482/why-trucks-will-drive-th...
  - tombrossman 12y ago
    There is a lot to automate, for example shifting the trailer tandem axles or the 'fifth wheel' to more evenly distribute the weight per axle. I don't know how an automated truck would handle driving across Wyoming with tens of thousands of big tumbleweeds blowing across the road, would the collision-avoidance system be triggered? A human knows what they are and that you just keep going full-speed. Snow is another issue. Sometimes you can safely drive through snowdrifts at speed and keep going. Sometimes it isn't a snowdrift at all, but a car covered in snow and abandoned on the highway, and the only way to tell is to approach slowly and look for an antenna sticking up or something like that. Not an everyday occurrence but it illustrates a scenario where human intelligence keeps you moving ahead when an automated system would probably need to stop and wait for human intervention. Trucking is a huge industry with well over 100% annual turnover, and many individual drivers taking liability for accidents that were preventable. With automated trucks, that liability burden may shift back to the companies who would no longer be able to plead ignorance. It's one more issue to deal with in addition to getting the technology right.
    - PhasmaFelis 12y ago
      In the snow example in particular, a properly-equipped autotruck could scan it with short-wave radar, which would go right through snow but bounce off metal. But that's a nitpick; there's lots of things that an experienced driver can handle easily but a robodriver would have trouble with.
    - derefr 12y ago
      You could certainly keep "control centers" with a few of those experienced drivers in them, where decisions for what the automated vehicle is to do in low-confidence situations get "escalated" to a human, along with the relevant sense data.

tombrossman 12y ago

The issue is that most drivers incorrectly assume they are in the weakest position for any given scenario. They absorb delays as if it were their own fault and falsify logs to compensate. Many drivers even absorbed the reimbursable toll costs on a route because they couldn't match the ticket times to their falsified logs. They are afraid to log as 'on duty not driving', which is how they legally should be doing it. Sure, they make less that one day but the sheer number of hours wasted at the shipper or consignee will have a knock-on effect which will make on-time delivery less likely. I drove tractor-trailers in the US for eight years and I would tell other drivers 'this system is broken, allow it to fail and cover your ass by documenting everything'. I refused to falsify my logs and would rigidly log everything 100% accurately, even logging Hours of Service violations (e.g. difficulty finding parking & going 30-45 min over on drive time) which could have cost me a ticket. Once in a while I'd get hauled into a weigh station for an inspection and they'd notice the hours violation. I explained about refusing to falsify and they'd see this was true. I'd get a funny look but never a ticket. The outcome here was that I was very predictable to the 'trip planners', who were one grade above the lowly dispatchers. The trip planners always knew exactly where I stood from the truck's telemetry data, plus I would always communicate delays. They were better able to predict how to use my time and their company truck. I was never out of pocket for reimbursable expenses because time/date stamps on receipts always matched. I was making more than most of our company-employed drivers and even some of the owner-operators who struggled with fuel costs, etc. The dispatchers hated me because they constantly had to explain to management why my loads were late and how I could not be blamed for the delays as I had documented everything and communicated the delays well in advance. Every other driver would have gone over their hours illegally to compensate, but I always stopped when I ran out of driving hours and therefore missed appointments. They all caught on after a while and learned to use my time more wisely. I reliably made $50-55K/year which was exceptional for trucking and enjoyed the very low tax rate Hours of Service workers get (9%, taking the standard deduction x days worked, typically). It was an interesting job overall because of all the sights you see, but I can't recommend it to anyone looking for a career change. Stick with the tech sector as it is much safer and you can go home every night.

npunt 12y ago
thanks for sharing your experience, it sounds like a tough job just to do the job right. do you think the system will get un-broken before we start seeing things like automated trucks? http://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775482/why-trucks-will-drive-themselves-before-cars-do http://www.vox.com/2014/6/3/5775482/why-trucks-will-drive-th...
- tombrossman 12y ago
  There is a lot to automate, for example shifting the trailer tandem axles or the 'fifth wheel' to more evenly distribute the weight per axle. I don't know how an automated truck would handle driving across Wyoming with tens of thousands of big tumbleweeds blowing across the road, would the collision-avoidance system be triggered? A human knows what they are and that you just keep going full-speed. Snow is another issue. Sometimes you can safely drive through snowdrifts at speed and keep going. Sometimes it isn't a snowdrift at all, but a car covered in snow and abandoned on the highway, and the only way to tell is to approach slowly and look for an antenna sticking up or something like that. Not an everyday occurrence but it illustrates a scenario where human intelligence keeps you moving ahead when an automated system would probably need to stop and wait for human intervention. Trucking is a huge industry with well over 100% annual turnover, and many individual drivers taking liability for accidents that were preventable. With automated trucks, that liability burden may shift back to the companies who would no longer be able to plead ignorance. It's one more issue to deal with in addition to getting the technology right.
  - PhasmaFelis 12y ago
    In the snow example in particular, a properly-equipped autotruck could scan it with short-wave radar, which would go right through snow but bounce off metal. But that's a nitpick; there's lots of things that an experienced driver can handle easily but a robodriver would have trouble with.
  - derefr 12y ago
    You could certainly keep "control centers" with a few of those experienced drivers in them, where decisions for what the automated vehicle is to do in low-confidence situations get "escalated" to a human, along with the relevant sense data.