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This just shows me that Tesla is able to execute. The Gigafactory, opening up patents, rapidly growing charger network, and the eventual $35k Gen III tells me

by pptr1 12y ago

This just shows me that Tesla is able to execute. The Gigafactory, opening up patents, rapidly growing charger network, and the eventual $35k Gen III tells me they have tons of potential in the future. Tesla is thinking big. They want everyone in the world to eventually have a electric car. I think they will own a significant share of premium market after they release the Gen III. However, they will be cars that people will desire at a cheaper price point than the Gen III, from different manufacturers. Also some people love certain car brands regardless of anything else, and mostly will stick to those brands. It will be great that those other car brands will be able to more easily make electric vehicles. Those electric cars from other manufacturers will most likely have a Tesla battery and charge on Tesla charging station. I think this is true disruption.

DannyBee 12y ago
"opening up patents" There is still no truly legally enforceable promise, that explains in detail, exactly what Elon is giving away and what he isn't, and what the terms are. It's now 1.5 months later, and despite many people asking such a thing, nothing has been forthcoming at all. So before you give them amazing amounts of credit for this, could we please wait till they actually do something more than PR?
- nitrogen 12y ago
  Do you know for sure that they haven't been negotiating the promised agreements in secret? I'd be very surprised if behemoth automakers managed to finish an agreement in less than two months, when it can take years in other cases. I'd also be surprised if the automakers wanted their names thrown around by Tesla before anything was official.
  - Chronic29 12y ago
    We know for sure they haven't been negotiating and agreement. You'd hear about it otherwise.
- tzm 12y ago
  Nissan and BMW are currently hammering details with Tesla on this very issue.
  - DannyBee 12y ago
    Great, so when that is resolved, and it ends up as Elon says it would, i'll happily give him credit. But that's still "in the future" :)
martin_bech 12y ago
Im going to repeat myself.. They are going to do to alot of car manufactures, the same thing Apple did to Nokia and Blackberry..
- celticninja 12y ago
  Is that to "F them in the A"?
  - DiabloD3 12y ago
    I feel this comment is getting downvoted, not because it is wrong, but because it is crude. I actually hope Tesla "Fs them in the A", because the entire industry has sat on its laurels for pretty much 20 years. Instead of innovating, they have been, essentially, polishing a turd.
    - grecy 12y ago
      > Instead of innovating, they have been, essentially, polishing a turd. In North America, yes. The rest of the automotive industry has been advancing a lot. I love that BMW get the same power/torque from a 3.0 liter engine as Ford/GM do out of a 6+ liter engine.
      - swimfar 12y ago
        Are you comparing a naturally aspirated engine with a turbo-charged engine? Also, I don't think it's fair to compare truck/utility engines (which generally run on regular gas) with the engines that go into BMW's highest performance cars. And, the 2.7 liter V6 which is going into the new F-150 supposedly makes 325hp. http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2015-ford-f-150-weighs-less-than-5-000-pounds-2-7-v6-m-1608913569 http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2015-ford-f-150-weighs-less-th...
        grecy 12y ago
        no, both N/A engines. You're comparing a 2015 engine to engines Europe have had for 20+ years. Yes, in recent years the North American manufacturers have caught up a little.. see the newer Ford V8, Jeep with VVT, etc. etc.
Shivetya 12y ago
Okay, but when does the factory first come online? The projections are for by 2020, so where do any possible cost savings for the III come from? Unless we can expect it to slip a few more years like the X did. I am hoping for a 200 mile range mid size, but I doubt Tesla will be first. I am also expecting range extender vehicles to have much more popularity initially because to be honest, I don't have time for 30 minute charge cycles when I am on trip and most people I know just want to get to their destination.
- toomuchtodo 12y ago
  > Okay, but when does the factory first come online? The projections are for by 2020, so where do any possible cost savings for the III come from? Unless we can expect it to slip a few more years like the X did. Tesla has already broken ground in several states for the Gigafactory (with plans to discard the sites they choose not to move forward with). I think 18-24 months is a reasonable timeline for them to be online.
- NickM 12y ago
  2020 is the estimate for full scale production at max capacity, not the estimate for when it will first come on line.
- cc438 12y ago
  I think pushing the mainstream launches back would be a wise decision. They've just begun their hard knock education in designing for longevity and reliability with the earliest examples of the Model S passing the 2 year mark. Traditional auto manufacturers have decades of experience driving the continual refinement of their designs. These efforts have resulted a general expectation among consumers of unfailing reliability and service life measured in decades. The issues they're experiencing with drive units are troubling but acceptable for most owners who know they bought a bleeding-edge testbed for future technology. My concern is one of time, things move relatively slow in the world of automotive engineering and these issues show Tesla has a lot to learn and a lot to change once they've discovered the points of failure. That kind of time doesn't fit with their expected release schedule and owners won't accept the kinds of failure rates experienced in the Model S in a mass market car.

by pptr1 12y ago

DannyBee 12y ago

"opening up patents" There is still no truly legally enforceable promise, that explains in detail, exactly what Elon is giving away and what he isn't, and what the terms are. It's now 1.5 months later, and despite many people asking such a thing, nothing has been forthcoming at all. So before you give them amazing amounts of credit for this, could we please wait till they actually do something more than PR?

nitrogen 12y ago
Do you know for sure that they haven't been negotiating the promised agreements in secret? I'd be very surprised if behemoth automakers managed to finish an agreement in less than two months, when it can take years in other cases. I'd also be surprised if the automakers wanted their names thrown around by Tesla before anything was official.
- Chronic29 12y ago
  We know for sure they haven't been negotiating and agreement. You'd hear about it otherwise.
tzm 12y ago
Nissan and BMW are currently hammering details with Tesla on this very issue.
- DannyBee 12y ago
  Great, so when that is resolved, and it ends up as Elon says it would, i'll happily give him credit. But that's still "in the future" :)

martin_bech 12y ago

Im going to repeat myself.. They are going to do to alot of car manufactures, the same thing Apple did to Nokia and Blackberry..

celticninja 12y ago
Is that to "F them in the A"?
- DiabloD3 12y ago
  I feel this comment is getting downvoted, not because it is wrong, but because it is crude. I actually hope Tesla "Fs them in the A", because the entire industry has sat on its laurels for pretty much 20 years. Instead of innovating, they have been, essentially, polishing a turd.
  - grecy 12y ago
    > Instead of innovating, they have been, essentially, polishing a turd. In North America, yes. The rest of the automotive industry has been advancing a lot. I love that BMW get the same power/torque from a 3.0 liter engine as Ford/GM do out of a 6+ liter engine.
    - swimfar 12y ago
      Are you comparing a naturally aspirated engine with a turbo-charged engine? Also, I don't think it's fair to compare truck/utility engines (which generally run on regular gas) with the engines that go into BMW's highest performance cars. And, the 2.7 liter V6 which is going into the new F-150 supposedly makes 325hp. http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2015-ford-f-150-weighs-less-than-5-000-pounds-2-7-v6-m-1608913569 http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2015-ford-f-150-weighs-less-th...
      - grecy 12y ago
        no, both N/A engines. You're comparing a 2015 engine to engines Europe have had for 20+ years. Yes, in recent years the North American manufacturers have caught up a little.. see the newer Ford V8, Jeep with VVT, etc. etc.

Shivetya 12y ago

Okay, but when does the factory first come online? The projections are for by 2020, so where do any possible cost savings for the III come from? Unless we can expect it to slip a few more years like the X did. I am hoping for a 200 mile range mid size, but I doubt Tesla will be first. I am also expecting range extender vehicles to have much more popularity initially because to be honest, I don't have time for 30 minute charge cycles when I am on trip and most people I know just want to get to their destination.

toomuchtodo 12y ago
> Okay, but when does the factory first come online? The projections are for by 2020, so where do any possible cost savings for the III come from? Unless we can expect it to slip a few more years like the X did. Tesla has already broken ground in several states for the Gigafactory (with plans to discard the sites they choose not to move forward with). I think 18-24 months is a reasonable timeline for them to be online.
NickM 12y ago
2020 is the estimate for full scale production at max capacity, not the estimate for when it will first come on line.
cc438 12y ago
I think pushing the mainstream launches back would be a wise decision. They've just begun their hard knock education in designing for longevity and reliability with the earliest examples of the Model S passing the 2 year mark. Traditional auto manufacturers have decades of experience driving the continual refinement of their designs. These efforts have resulted a general expectation among consumers of unfailing reliability and service life measured in decades. The issues they're experiencing with drive units are troubling but acceptable for most owners who know they bought a bleeding-edge testbed for future technology. My concern is one of time, things move relatively slow in the world of automotive engineering and these issues show Tesla has a lot to learn and a lot to change once they've discovered the points of failure. That kind of time doesn't fit with their expected release schedule and owners won't accept the kinds of failure rates experienced in the Model S in a mass market car.