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Apple Allows the World’s Most Popular Bitcoin Wallet Back Into Its Store

51 points by ISL 12y ago

ceejayoz 12y ago
> Today, he acknowledges that Apple’s about-face could be related to changes in the regulatory environment, but he thinks Apple’s new attitude comes down to one thing: Android. I'd imagine nearly no one is buying Android phones because you can get a Bitcoin app for them. Chances are good Apple's lawyers said "shut it down, we need to figure this out first" and this is the end result. No conspiracy theories required.
- Alupis 12y ago
  > I'd imagine nearly no one is buying Android phones because you can get a Bitcoin app for them. No, they're buying Android phones for just about every other reason (approx 80% marketshare according to IDC [1]) [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/iphone-v-android-market-share-2014-5 http://www.businessinsider.com/iphone-v-android-market-share...
  - fleshweasel 12y ago
    On the other hand there's a large portion of android users that really aren't participants in its app economy. At this point the value the iOS market presents to developers equals Android and the cost and hassle of developing for iOS is significantly less. Android winds up being a haven for techies who want to run task managers and antivirus on their phones, people who religiously hate Apple and people who want to spend as little as possible on a smartphone.
    - Alupis 12y ago
      Not true anymore -- see my comment above regarding Android revenue share.
  - coldtea 12y ago
    Most of the "reasons" being money. Android phones are mostly sold to the "unwashed masses" who just want a cheap phone and get some low/medium spec Android phone with their contract. You cannot really compare something sold in 200 models and 50 price points to something sold in 5 models and 5 price points. It will be like saying people buy more Toyotas than Mercedes. Well, of course they do. Here's another data point: this 80% of marketshare is reversed when considering profits.
    - Alupis 12y ago
      > Here's another data point: this 80% of marketshare is reversed when considering profits Actually, not true. iOS only controls about 52.7% of the revenue share -- however Android has been creeping up every quarter and now places like Forbes and BusinessInsider are predicting Android will overtake iOS in revenue share in not too long.[1] [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-revenue-android-2014-4 http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-revenue-android-2014-4
- kumarm 12y ago
  Lets not forget iPhone in available on more networks in US because of Android threat :). More App's (By that I mean both in number and Quality) available on Android than iOS is not something Apple would want to become a common theme. That alone already made them more open and will continue to do so.
- drewcrawford 12y ago
  I have extensive, direct, front-row experience with getting difficult apps into the store (though not Bitcoin-related). The pattern you describe "shut it down, we need to figure this out first" is very accurate. The app is pulled while somebody high up figures out what the policy is going to be. Often the policy involves setting up safeguards (that you may or may not have already implemented) for abuse, user privacy, legal compliance, etc. These new guidelines are then consistently applied throughout the store (although some of them are unwritten and never make it into the official list.) This process is slow, and not very transparent. However as a person who has been on the receiving end many times I think it is a net positive for the end customer. Sure, I would prefer a system that is both transparent and safe, but it's not so bad really.
- yaeger 12y ago
  That sounds right. Especially given the rumor that Apple is cooking up their own mobile payment service. I guess when you try to do something like this, the lawyers and other higher ups need to figure a lot of things out first. And this bitcoin business looks like it falls somewhere either within this scope or at least very very close to it. I think they needed this time to get a comprehensive look what they were planning re: mobile payments and how bitcoin dealing might be affected by this.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
- testbmaa 12y ago
  Source? Any official communication or change?
- ceejayoz 12y ago
  This is an odd quibble. If "no coin sending functionality" was grounds for rejection, there was indeed a ban on Bitcoin transaction apps (as further evidenced by the fact that others didn't pop up). That they tried to get around the restriction doesn't mean it wasn't there...
dgarrett 12y ago
Be warned, the security of this app is not great. It stores your Blockchain.info password and your app's PIN in plaintext on your phone, retrievable over USB. It also stores an encrypted copy of your Bitcoin wallet right next to the plaintext password (which can be used to decrypt the wallet). I haven't checked, but I imagine these files might be included in iTunes backups of the device too. The sandbox keeps it safe from other apps, but you are 100% insecure on a jailbroken device. They did add a new PIN lock to the app, but again this is not used to encrypt your private key and is only a UI lock.
- interpol_p 12y ago
  That does sound pretty poor. However, if the app stores its data in /Documents and you have a lock on your phone (preferably complex passphrase / touch ID) then the app's data should be encrypted on your device.
  - schrodinger 12y ago
    They should really just store the private key and password in the keychain, it's super simple to do.
  - 0x0 12y ago
    Didn't the recent "scandal" about those usb "backdoor" services show that this isn't good enough; you need to set those explicit NSFileProtectionComplete attributes?
    - superuser2 12y ago
      The usb "backdoor" applies only to computers you have specifically authorized by unlocking the phone and tapping "trust this computer." If you can unlock the phone, you could just transfer yourself the contents of the bitcoin wallet anyway.
      - dgarrett 12y ago
        Well, if you have access to an unlockable phone, this would get you access to the Blockchain app's data despite the app's PIN lock.
newman8r 12y ago
they are very wary of any app that could be using digital currency to act as "in-app-currency" which undermines apple's in-app-purchases
- ceejayoz 12y ago
  Oh, bull. It'd be significantly easier to use credit cards for IAP than Bitcoin. Apple prevents this easily with the review process.
  - newman8r 12y ago
    yes, they require using IAP and will reject any app trying to circumvent it. I was just making the point that apple is allowing wallet apps but they're still not approving (to my knowledge) any apps that let you replace IAP functionality with crypto transfers.
- wmf 12y ago
  That may be the case, but did any of the banned Bitcoin apps actually try to do IAP? How would Bitcoin IAP work, given the lack of inter-app communication in iOS?
  - 0x0 12y ago
    It's probably more a case of IAP being the only sanctioned way to pay for digital services inside apps, with bitcoin transactions being a way to bypass the entire 30% cut that Apple takes for IAPs.
    - ceejayoz 12y ago
      No more than credit cards, PayPal, etc. are. Both methods would result in your app being rejected, so Apple has nothing to fear there.
tzs 12y ago
Perhaps this time they didn't blatantly violate Apple's rules by including major functionality that was completely hidden until enabled on the server, and not turning that on until after review. Apple wants to review the app users are going to see. Previous discussion from back when that happened: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7194085 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7194085

51 points by ISL 12y ago

> Today, he acknowledges that Apple’s about-face could be related to changes in the regulatory environment, but he thinks Apple’s new attitude comes down to one thing: Android. I'd imagine nearly no one is buying Android phones because you can get a Bitcoin app for them. Chances are good Apple's lawyers said "shut it down, we need to figure this out first" and this is the end result. No conspiracy theories required.

Alupis 12y ago
> I'd imagine nearly no one is buying Android phones because you can get a Bitcoin app for them. No, they're buying Android phones for just about every other reason (approx 80% marketshare according to IDC [1]) [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/iphone-v-android-market-share-2014-5 http://www.businessinsider.com/iphone-v-android-market-share...
- fleshweasel 12y ago
  On the other hand there's a large portion of android users that really aren't participants in its app economy. At this point the value the iOS market presents to developers equals Android and the cost and hassle of developing for iOS is significantly less. Android winds up being a haven for techies who want to run task managers and antivirus on their phones, people who religiously hate Apple and people who want to spend as little as possible on a smartphone.
  - Alupis 12y ago
    Not true anymore -- see my comment above regarding Android revenue share.
- coldtea 12y ago
  Most of the "reasons" being money. Android phones are mostly sold to the "unwashed masses" who just want a cheap phone and get some low/medium spec Android phone with their contract. You cannot really compare something sold in 200 models and 50 price points to something sold in 5 models and 5 price points. It will be like saying people buy more Toyotas than Mercedes. Well, of course they do. Here's another data point: this 80% of marketshare is reversed when considering profits.
  - Alupis 12y ago
    > Here's another data point: this 80% of marketshare is reversed when considering profits Actually, not true. iOS only controls about 52.7% of the revenue share -- however Android has been creeping up every quarter and now places like Forbes and BusinessInsider are predicting Android will overtake iOS in revenue share in not too long.[1] [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-revenue-android-2014-4 http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-revenue-android-2014-4
kumarm 12y ago
Lets not forget iPhone in available on more networks in US because of Android threat :). More App's (By that I mean both in number and Quality) available on Android than iOS is not something Apple would want to become a common theme. That alone already made them more open and will continue to do so.
drewcrawford 12y ago
I have extensive, direct, front-row experience with getting difficult apps into the store (though not Bitcoin-related). The pattern you describe "shut it down, we need to figure this out first" is very accurate. The app is pulled while somebody high up figures out what the policy is going to be. Often the policy involves setting up safeguards (that you may or may not have already implemented) for abuse, user privacy, legal compliance, etc. These new guidelines are then consistently applied throughout the store (although some of them are unwritten and never make it into the official list.) This process is slow, and not very transparent. However as a person who has been on the receiving end many times I think it is a net positive for the end customer. Sure, I would prefer a system that is both transparent and safe, but it's not so bad really.
yaeger 12y ago
That sounds right. Especially given the rumor that Apple is cooking up their own mobile payment service. I guess when you try to do something like this, the lawyers and other higher ups need to figure a lot of things out first. And this bitcoin business looks like it falls somewhere either within this scope or at least very very close to it. I think they needed this time to get a comprehensive look what they were planning re: mobile payments and how bitcoin dealing might be affected by this.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

testbmaa 12y ago
Source? Any official communication or change?
ceejayoz 12y ago
This is an odd quibble. If "no coin sending functionality" was grounds for rejection, there was indeed a ban on Bitcoin transaction apps (as further evidenced by the fact that others didn't pop up). That they tried to get around the restriction doesn't mean it wasn't there...

dgarrett 12y ago

Be warned, the security of this app is not great. It stores your Blockchain.info password and your app's PIN in plaintext on your phone, retrievable over USB. It also stores an encrypted copy of your Bitcoin wallet right next to the plaintext password (which can be used to decrypt the wallet). I haven't checked, but I imagine these files might be included in iTunes backups of the device too. The sandbox keeps it safe from other apps, but you are 100% insecure on a jailbroken device. They did add a new PIN lock to the app, but again this is not used to encrypt your private key and is only a UI lock.

interpol_p 12y ago
That does sound pretty poor. However, if the app stores its data in /Documents and you have a lock on your phone (preferably complex passphrase / touch ID) then the app's data should be encrypted on your device.
- schrodinger 12y ago
  They should really just store the private key and password in the keychain, it's super simple to do.
- 0x0 12y ago
  Didn't the recent "scandal" about those usb "backdoor" services show that this isn't good enough; you need to set those explicit NSFileProtectionComplete attributes?
  - superuser2 12y ago
    The usb "backdoor" applies only to computers you have specifically authorized by unlocking the phone and tapping "trust this computer." If you can unlock the phone, you could just transfer yourself the contents of the bitcoin wallet anyway.
    - dgarrett 12y ago
      Well, if you have access to an unlockable phone, this would get you access to the Blockchain app's data despite the app's PIN lock.

newman8r 12y ago

they are very wary of any app that could be using digital currency to act as "in-app-currency" which undermines apple's in-app-purchases

ceejayoz 12y ago
Oh, bull. It'd be significantly easier to use credit cards for IAP than Bitcoin. Apple prevents this easily with the review process.
- newman8r 12y ago
  yes, they require using IAP and will reject any app trying to circumvent it. I was just making the point that apple is allowing wallet apps but they're still not approving (to my knowledge) any apps that let you replace IAP functionality with crypto transfers.
wmf 12y ago
That may be the case, but did any of the banned Bitcoin apps actually try to do IAP? How would Bitcoin IAP work, given the lack of inter-app communication in iOS?
- 0x0 12y ago
  It's probably more a case of IAP being the only sanctioned way to pay for digital services inside apps, with bitcoin transactions being a way to bypass the entire 30% cut that Apple takes for IAPs.
  - ceejayoz 12y ago
    No more than credit cards, PayPal, etc. are. Both methods would result in your app being rejected, so Apple has nothing to fear there.

tzs 12y ago

Perhaps this time they didn't blatantly violate Apple's rules by including major functionality that was completely hidden until enabled on the server, and not turning that on until after review. Apple wants to review the app users are going to see. Previous discussion from back when that happened: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7194085 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7194085