4 ms·

If they would have denied helping me because of some security policy, I would agree with you, but their support didn't understand the problem and just stopped r

by schmidp 12y ago

If they would have denied helping me because of some security policy, I would agree with you, but their support didn't understand the problem and just stopped responding. What if you run into a bug? From my experience I would not expect to get any qualified help.

javert 12y ago
I wonder if you can sue them, or if there is other legal recourse. Probably.
- jonknee 12y ago
  Probably not. These days as a consumer you can't really sue companies you do business with because they make you agree to arbitrate any disputes. It's nutty. Briefly checking the Coinbase TOS reveals this: > 8.2. Arbitration; Waiver of Class Action. EXCEPT FOR CLAIMS FOR INJUNCTIVE OR EQUITABLE RELIEF OR CLAIMS REGARDING INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS (WHICH MAY BE BROUGHT IN ANY COMPETENT COURT WITHOUT THE POSTING OF A BOND), ANY DISPUTE ARISING UNDER THIS AGREEMENT SHALL BE FINALLY SETTLED ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE AMERICAN ARBITRATION ASSOCIATION'S RULES FOR ARBITRATION OF CONSUMER-RELATED DISPUTES AND YOU AND COINBASE HEREBY EXPRESSLY WAIVE TRIAL BY JURY. https://coinbase.com/legal/user_agreement https://coinbase.com/legal/user_agreement
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - javert 12y ago
    I wonder if that really applies in this case / would hold up. I mean, if I do not enter into a contract with Coinbase and they come to have property that belongs to me and refuse to release it to me, I can surely sue them. I'm not sure that you can get someone to sign away basic property rights in a contract. Analogously, if I lose my password to my bank's website, I bet I can legally force them to return my funds.
    - jonknee 12y ago
      You do enter into a contract with Coinbase though, by signing up you have to agree to that. Banks are different (highly regulated, but also house real hard currency!) and simply losing a password isn't going to have the same effect. There was an interesting article about this in the NYT recently. Apparently arbitration clauses do have a decent chance of standing up to challenge. It's discomforting because when all the vendors in a space have the clause there is no way to have your right to trial. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/your-money/a-closer-look-at-the-arbitration-process-for-investors.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/your-money/a-closer-look-a... It's even more dubious in finance because you not only agree to arbitration, but you agree to arbitration by the private financial regulatory organization Finra. Think about that--to get a brokerage account you must agree to arbitration through Wall Street's self-funded watchdog. Unsurprisingly Wall Street has a great track record in winning.

by schmidp 12y ago

javert 12y ago

I wonder if you can sue them, or if there is other legal recourse. Probably.

jonknee 12y ago
Probably not. These days as a consumer you can't really sue companies you do business with because they make you agree to arbitrate any disputes. It's nutty. Briefly checking the Coinbase TOS reveals this: > 8.2. Arbitration; Waiver of Class Action. EXCEPT FOR CLAIMS FOR INJUNCTIVE OR EQUITABLE RELIEF OR CLAIMS REGARDING INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS (WHICH MAY BE BROUGHT IN ANY COMPETENT COURT WITHOUT THE POSTING OF A BOND), ANY DISPUTE ARISING UNDER THIS AGREEMENT SHALL BE FINALLY SETTLED ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE AMERICAN ARBITRATION ASSOCIATION'S RULES FOR ARBITRATION OF CONSUMER-RELATED DISPUTES AND YOU AND COINBASE HEREBY EXPRESSLY WAIVE TRIAL BY JURY. https://coinbase.com/legal/user_agreement https://coinbase.com/legal/user_agreement
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- javert 12y ago
  I wonder if that really applies in this case / would hold up. I mean, if I do not enter into a contract with Coinbase and they come to have property that belongs to me and refuse to release it to me, I can surely sue them. I'm not sure that you can get someone to sign away basic property rights in a contract. Analogously, if I lose my password to my bank's website, I bet I can legally force them to return my funds.
  - jonknee 12y ago
    You do enter into a contract with Coinbase though, by signing up you have to agree to that. Banks are different (highly regulated, but also house real hard currency!) and simply losing a password isn't going to have the same effect. There was an interesting article about this in the NYT recently. Apparently arbitration clauses do have a decent chance of standing up to challenge. It's discomforting because when all the vendors in a space have the clause there is no way to have your right to trial. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/your-money/a-closer-look-at-the-arbitration-process-for-investors.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/your-money/a-closer-look-a... It's even more dubious in finance because you not only agree to arbitration, but you agree to arbitration by the private financial regulatory organization Finra. Think about that--to get a brokerage account you must agree to arbitration through Wall Street's self-funded watchdog. Unsurprisingly Wall Street has a great track record in winning.