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In practice zipper merging works amazingly well. MNDOT has used signage to tell drivers to maintain speed and stay in their lanes for the past few years of con

In practice zipper merging works amazingly well. MNDOT has used signage to tell drivers to maintain speed and stay in their lanes for the past few years of construction in the northern Twin Cities. You wouldn't believe how much faster traffic moves when these simple reminders are posted. The problem is that without the signs (and enforcement) drivers in the Twin Cities Metro regularly shoot to seal any gap that may allow someone signaling to enter their lane, regardless of the distance to the merge point. This behavior also occurs in on-ramp situations where drivers are entering the highway and slow lane drivers refuse to move over, but don't want you in front of them! I have driven in many states and never has the mentality that you cannot, MUST NOT, let someone ahead of you been as bad as it is here. Minnesota Nice, indeed.

dusing 12y ago
I live in the Twin Cities and "Minnesota nice" means merging incredibly early when a lane is posted as closed. As a transplant I can always count on getting and extra 1/2 - 1 mile ahead by staying in the closed lane. It is getting better, but still 40% of the time the car at the end of the zipper merge is NOT happy to see you, and thinks they are letting you in. Signage is helping at the big construction areas.
- hockeybias 12y ago
  You nailed it.
- VikingCoder 12y ago
  "Getting ahead" means you're not following the whole point of this idea, which is to MINIMIZE the speed differential between the two lanes. If you want to show people how it's done, you go the same speed as the cars next to you in the open lane, and zipper merge at the end. GRRRRR. Yes, THEY are doing it wrong, because they're early merging. (IDIOTS!) But you are ALSO doing it wrong. I'm reminded of the George Carlin comment that everyone who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everyone who drives faster than you is an asshole.
  - dusing 12y ago
    "Getting ahead" does not mean speeding, and its hard to go the same speed as the full lane when it is at a stand still. I do slow down from the speed limit significantly just in case someone wants to pop out.
- tedsanders 12y ago
  The whole point of zipper merging is to minimize speed differences between lanes for maximum efficiency and maximum safety. The proper way to execute a late zipper merge is to match speeds and merge at the end. You are not correctly zipper merging if you are passing other cars before merging at the end.
  - boyaka 12y ago
    He is helping to correct traffic. Everybody else is messing up the zipper merging by not filling in both lanes equally.
    - tedsanders 12y ago
      No. The way to correct traffic is to stay in the right lane, moving at the same speed as the other lane, and merge at the end. That is what the zipper merge is. Driving at a faster speed than the other lane does not correct anything.
      - QuiteMouse 12y ago
        The zip line is always free though, so obviously you're going to be going faster then the other lane that is backed up with traffic.
        tedsanders 12y ago
        Again, the correct way to zipper merge is to reduce your speed to the traffic beside you and then merge at the end. The whole reason zipper merging is efficient and safe is that both lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, making merging quick and easy. If you zoom past the other lane of traffic, you are actually worse than the early mergers in terms of safety and efficiency. Edit: For those of you downvoting me, could you please explain your reasoning? Do you disagree with the content of my message or its delivery?
        simias 12y ago
TrainedMonkey 12y ago
I'd imagine zipper merging situation would change dramatically as soon as long trucks are involved.
- ChikkaChiChi 12y ago
  If everyone maintains speed it's actually not a big deal.
  - frogpelt 12y ago
    Unless they didn't maintain enough space for the big truck. Then someone has to slow down.
    - seandougall 12y ago
      Or unless more than one lane is closed, or there's, you know, actual traffic. I would love to drive in a place where "you don't even take your foot off the brake" works, closures or no.
incision 12y ago
>'I have driven in many states and never has the mentality that you cannot, MUST NOT, let someone ahead of you been as bad as it is here. Minnesota Nice, indeed.' We don't rule the lists anymore [1], but I'll put the horrible traffic and drivers of the DMV (DC, Maryland, Virginia) up against anyone in a gridlocked struggle for the title of worst. Though, I've routinely been told by people more traveled than myself that we hardly rate on an international scale. 1: http://www.weather.com/news/commuter-conditions/worst-traffic-cities-america-2014-20140711 http://www.weather.com/news/commuter-conditions/worst-traffi...
- rayiner 12y ago
  Grew up driving in DC/MD/VA. I think PA/NJ/DE is much worse.
  - idbehold 12y ago
    That's funny. I grew up driving in PA then moved down to DC for a job and I think DC/MD/VA drivers are much worse. It's like none of them have ever driven in the rain before. "Holy shit the road is made of ice, better drive at least 15mph under the speed limit." - The thought process of every DMV driver when it starts to drizzle.
- oostevo 12y ago
  From my experience, South America, Africa, and the Middle East have horrifying traffic behavior, but at least everyone follows the same unofficial rules of the road. Eventually, you can somewhat reliably predict how someone on the road will behave. Different areas in the US have very different driving cultures, and the transient nature of the DC area means that drivers bring their habits from wherever they came from, and so everyone is obeying slightly different driving cultural norms. It's a mess.

dusing 12y ago

I live in the Twin Cities and "Minnesota nice" means merging incredibly early when a lane is posted as closed. As a transplant I can always count on getting and extra 1/2 - 1 mile ahead by staying in the closed lane. It is getting better, but still 40% of the time the car at the end of the zipper merge is NOT happy to see you, and thinks they are letting you in. Signage is helping at the big construction areas.

hockeybias 12y ago
You nailed it.
VikingCoder 12y ago
"Getting ahead" means you're not following the whole point of this idea, which is to MINIMIZE the speed differential between the two lanes. If you want to show people how it's done, you go the same speed as the cars next to you in the open lane, and zipper merge at the end. GRRRRR. Yes, THEY are doing it wrong, because they're early merging. (IDIOTS!) But you are ALSO doing it wrong. I'm reminded of the George Carlin comment that everyone who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everyone who drives faster than you is an asshole.
- dusing 12y ago
  "Getting ahead" does not mean speeding, and its hard to go the same speed as the full lane when it is at a stand still. I do slow down from the speed limit significantly just in case someone wants to pop out.
tedsanders 12y ago
The whole point of zipper merging is to minimize speed differences between lanes for maximum efficiency and maximum safety. The proper way to execute a late zipper merge is to match speeds and merge at the end. You are not correctly zipper merging if you are passing other cars before merging at the end.
- boyaka 12y ago
  He is helping to correct traffic. Everybody else is messing up the zipper merging by not filling in both lanes equally.
  - tedsanders 12y ago
    No. The way to correct traffic is to stay in the right lane, moving at the same speed as the other lane, and merge at the end. That is what the zipper merge is. Driving at a faster speed than the other lane does not correct anything.
    - QuiteMouse 12y ago
      The zip line is always free though, so obviously you're going to be going faster then the other lane that is backed up with traffic.
      - tedsanders 12y ago
        Again, the correct way to zipper merge is to reduce your speed to the traffic beside you and then merge at the end. The whole reason zipper merging is efficient and safe is that both lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, making merging quick and easy. If you zoom past the other lane of traffic, you are actually worse than the early mergers in terms of safety and efficiency. Edit: For those of you downvoting me, could you please explain your reasoning? Do you disagree with the content of my message or its delivery?
        simias 12y ago

TrainedMonkey 12y ago

I'd imagine zipper merging situation would change dramatically as soon as long trucks are involved.

ChikkaChiChi 12y ago
If everyone maintains speed it's actually not a big deal.
- frogpelt 12y ago
  Unless they didn't maintain enough space for the big truck. Then someone has to slow down.
  - seandougall 12y ago
    Or unless more than one lane is closed, or there's, you know, actual traffic. I would love to drive in a place where "you don't even take your foot off the brake" works, closures or no.

incision 12y ago

>'I have driven in many states and never has the mentality that you cannot, MUST NOT, let someone ahead of you been as bad as it is here. Minnesota Nice, indeed.' We don't rule the lists anymore [1], but I'll put the horrible traffic and drivers of the DMV (DC, Maryland, Virginia) up against anyone in a gridlocked struggle for the title of worst. Though, I've routinely been told by people more traveled than myself that we hardly rate on an international scale. 1: http://www.weather.com/news/commuter-conditions/worst-traffic-cities-america-2014-20140711 http://www.weather.com/news/commuter-conditions/worst-traffi...

rayiner 12y ago
Grew up driving in DC/MD/VA. I think PA/NJ/DE is much worse.
- idbehold 12y ago
  That's funny. I grew up driving in PA then moved down to DC for a job and I think DC/MD/VA drivers are much worse. It's like none of them have ever driven in the rain before. "Holy shit the road is made of ice, better drive at least 15mph under the speed limit." - The thought process of every DMV driver when it starts to drizzle.
oostevo 12y ago
From my experience, South America, Africa, and the Middle East have horrifying traffic behavior, but at least everyone follows the same unofficial rules of the road. Eventually, you can somewhat reliably predict how someone on the road will behave. Different areas in the US have very different driving cultures, and the transient nature of the DC area means that drivers bring their habits from wherever they came from, and so everyone is obeying slightly different driving cultural norms. It's a mess.