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Genius? A weak man can lift a small rock. A strong man can lift a large rock. But to lift a ten ton boulder, you need a crane. Even a weak man can operate a

by adamtj 12y ago

Genius? A weak man can lift a small rock. A strong man can lift a large rock. But to lift a ten ton boulder, you need a crane. Even a weak man can operate a crane, if he knows how. Your genius is like a strong but stupid man. Maybe he or she can lift a 1400 line 'if' rock, I mean block, but that's probably the limit. Any more would require a different mode of operation -- the programming equivalent of using a crane. The point is that people who haven't broken the 1500 line wall will write code with no structure. That's why they can't break through the wall. That's the heaviest code they can lift without assistance. Certainly there are well structured 1500 line programs. But those overwhelmingly come from people who have broken through that limit. The people who know how to use a crane will tend to use them even for smaller projects. Why would I go to all the trouble to use a giant crane just to lift a smallish 20 kg (40 lbs) rock? Because then I won't get tired or strain my back. So I can lift another. And another, and another. I can do this all day without breaking a sweat. The strong man is tired and sore and worn out from just a few dozen small rocks, while I'm still fresh, still going, and still able to lift multi-ton boulders.

walshemj 12y ago
And your point is? We where doing MR back in the early 80's on the largest cluster of super mini's in the UK - dam right Cliff was a genius the project would have not worked with out him.
- adamtj 12y ago
  My point? What, are you feeling insulted? If so, stop. After all, I don't know him or you or anything about the project you were on. Anybody reading my comment would know that. I thought maybe you missed the point of the article, that's all. Read it again, more closely. Perhaps then you'll see Cliff in a different light. If you missed the point of the article and he wrote a 1400 line 'if' statement, then it's at least plausible that you're both stuck behind that first or second wall. I could easily be wrong. Then again, maybe this article has the key you need to catapult yourself far ahead of Cliff. He may well be a genius, but you could potentially be far more effective and productive. You may even be able to accomplish things that Cliff would fail at. So, give the article another read.
  - walshemj 12y ago
    Ladies and gentleman I give you a prime example of unconscious incompetence
  - metaphorm 12y ago
    Fortran77 though. pretty limited set of organizational tools to work with there. Procs and Modules is it, I think (though I'm no expert). Many of the patterns we're used to using for code organization just wouldn't be available. So how you would deal with a really big if statement without having more sophisticated tools? The business logic must have had a very large number of conditional branches. Even if you encapsulate the instructions of each branch in their own proc, it still doesn't change the fact that you're going to have a large number of conditions. This isn't particularly a solved problem even in modern languages. We can use all kinds of layers of abstraction to make individual units of code smaller, but it's sort of an illusion. Splatting your business logic across a dozen or more files/modules/classes whatever might make it easier to look at in a text editor but it doesn't make it easier to develop or test. If you've got complex business logic you're going to have a complex program.
    - walshemj 12y ago
      the system was broken down into a lot of sub processes from memory the 1400 long branch if was just a branching if then else statement - most weren't as bad. A core part of the documentation was large number of A1 sheets which covered an entre wall of our office ;-) The core of the system working out what do to with all the log records was a collection of Pl/1G. We did have to build a lot of extra stuff you get for free nowadays we had a custom build system that you could use to build any part or the whole system written in primes JCL.

by adamtj 12y ago

walshemj 12y ago

And your point is? We where doing MR back in the early 80's on the largest cluster of super mini's in the UK - dam right Cliff was a genius the project would have not worked with out him.

adamtj 12y ago
My point? What, are you feeling insulted? If so, stop. After all, I don't know him or you or anything about the project you were on. Anybody reading my comment would know that. I thought maybe you missed the point of the article, that's all. Read it again, more closely. Perhaps then you'll see Cliff in a different light. If you missed the point of the article and he wrote a 1400 line 'if' statement, then it's at least plausible that you're both stuck behind that first or second wall. I could easily be wrong. Then again, maybe this article has the key you need to catapult yourself far ahead of Cliff. He may well be a genius, but you could potentially be far more effective and productive. You may even be able to accomplish things that Cliff would fail at. So, give the article another read.
- walshemj 12y ago
  Ladies and gentleman I give you a prime example of unconscious incompetence
- metaphorm 12y ago
  Fortran77 though. pretty limited set of organizational tools to work with there. Procs and Modules is it, I think (though I'm no expert). Many of the patterns we're used to using for code organization just wouldn't be available. So how you would deal with a really big if statement without having more sophisticated tools? The business logic must have had a very large number of conditional branches. Even if you encapsulate the instructions of each branch in their own proc, it still doesn't change the fact that you're going to have a large number of conditions. This isn't particularly a solved problem even in modern languages. We can use all kinds of layers of abstraction to make individual units of code smaller, but it's sort of an illusion. Splatting your business logic across a dozen or more files/modules/classes whatever might make it easier to look at in a text editor but it doesn't make it easier to develop or test. If you've got complex business logic you're going to have a complex program.
  - walshemj 12y ago
    the system was broken down into a lot of sub processes from memory the 1400 long branch if was just a branching if then else statement - most weren't as bad. A core part of the documentation was large number of A1 sheets which covered an entre wall of our office ;-) The core of the system working out what do to with all the log records was a collection of Pl/1G. We did have to build a lot of extra stuff you get for free nowadays we had a custom build system that you could use to build any part or the whole system written in primes JCL.