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See, this is the sort of thing that I hate reading about. Like, yes, we have drones, and yes, we have firearms, and yes, we can add one to the other--but is it

See, this is the sort of thing that I hate reading about. Like, yes, we have drones, and yes, we have firearms, and yes, we can add one to the other--but is it really a good idea? The potential for abuse of such systems is absurd; I cannot believe that any engineer with a shred of morality would voluntarily work on such things without at least a solid explanation of why doing so is permissible. Mark my words: these things will mostly be used against civilians and dissidents--not standing armies.

mkr-hn 12y ago
The mantra I usually hear around here in regards to tech's harms--like putting people out of work--is to make the advances and let society adapt. It seems very shortsighted.
- aaronem 12y ago
  Well, someone's going to do it.
  - mkr-hn 12y ago
    That doesn't mean the person who does it can't think about ways to deal with the social implications.
    - cortesoft 12y ago
      Right, but it does mean the solution isn't "Just don't build the weapon"
      - mkr-hn 12y ago
        I'm not the one saying that.
    - seanflyon 12y ago
      Once you invent something, it exists; You have little power over the social implications.
- seanflyon 12y ago
  I think that technology that provides goods and services more efficiently is quite different from technology that kills people more efficiently. Think of all those hunters and gatherers who were put out of work with the advent of farming, or all those farmers who lost their jobs when we switched away from a subsistence farming economy. "Make the advances and let society adapt" has worked quite well in the past.
mschuster91 12y ago
> Mark my words: these things will mostly be used against civilians and dissidents--not standing armies. Which is why I (German) really hate our weapons law. War will come back to Europe, we are on the fringe of a fucking Cold War turning into a Hot War with the Russians in Ukraine. Not to mention the rising inequality in Europe - if it blows up one day, it will hit hard. I'd like to be equipped and trained properly instead of being restricted to gas revolvers, stones and arrows. Or knives, which are useless as I'm a terrible close-range fighter.
- lesingerouge 12y ago
  I don't really understand how buying your own gun/rifle/whatever would be of any help in surviving a war. The last couple of recent wars (think Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc) were fought mostly with "big tech" (airplanes, bombs, tanks, etc) which is pretty deadly to low level mosquitoes like civilians and foot soldiers. And while talking about inequality, I am quite uncertain about how a gun/rifle would help you. You would shoot the guy going through your trash? Or the guy stealing your bike? I am quite skeptical that a proliferation of this kind of thing would help you much with your "problems".
  - mschuster91 12y ago
    > The last couple of recent wars (think Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc) were fought mostly with "big tech" (airplanes, bombs, tanks, etc) which is pretty deadly to low level mosquitoes like civilians and foot soldiers. EU vs Russia may not be fought on German territory any soon, but civil wars inside the EU are not that far away (hell, they're hunting down jews and black people already)... Also, I'm not really a supporter of big-caliber shotguns in private hands - but we're not even allowed to own handguns! Fine, not being allowed to carry in public is something I accept and deem necessary, but not even being allowed to possess them is just ridiculous given the huge number of illegal guns.
    - seanflyon 12y ago
      > they're hunting down jews and black people already What are you talking about?
Crito 12y ago
At least drones tend to have cameras, and their operators cannot excuse their own actions by claiming that their lives were at risk. Drones have the potential to be more audit-able.

mkr-hn 12y ago

The mantra I usually hear around here in regards to tech's harms--like putting people out of work--is to make the advances and let society adapt. It seems very shortsighted.

aaronem 12y ago
Well, someone's going to do it.
- mkr-hn 12y ago
  That doesn't mean the person who does it can't think about ways to deal with the social implications.
  - cortesoft 12y ago
    Right, but it does mean the solution isn't "Just don't build the weapon"
    - mkr-hn 12y ago
      I'm not the one saying that.
  - seanflyon 12y ago
    Once you invent something, it exists; You have little power over the social implications.
seanflyon 12y ago
I think that technology that provides goods and services more efficiently is quite different from technology that kills people more efficiently. Think of all those hunters and gatherers who were put out of work with the advent of farming, or all those farmers who lost their jobs when we switched away from a subsistence farming economy. "Make the advances and let society adapt" has worked quite well in the past.

mschuster91 12y ago

> Mark my words: these things will mostly be used against civilians and dissidents--not standing armies. Which is why I (German) really hate our weapons law. War will come back to Europe, we are on the fringe of a fucking Cold War turning into a Hot War with the Russians in Ukraine. Not to mention the rising inequality in Europe - if it blows up one day, it will hit hard. I'd like to be equipped and trained properly instead of being restricted to gas revolvers, stones and arrows. Or knives, which are useless as I'm a terrible close-range fighter.

lesingerouge 12y ago
I don't really understand how buying your own gun/rifle/whatever would be of any help in surviving a war. The last couple of recent wars (think Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc) were fought mostly with "big tech" (airplanes, bombs, tanks, etc) which is pretty deadly to low level mosquitoes like civilians and foot soldiers. And while talking about inequality, I am quite uncertain about how a gun/rifle would help you. You would shoot the guy going through your trash? Or the guy stealing your bike? I am quite skeptical that a proliferation of this kind of thing would help you much with your "problems".
- mschuster91 12y ago
  > The last couple of recent wars (think Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc) were fought mostly with "big tech" (airplanes, bombs, tanks, etc) which is pretty deadly to low level mosquitoes like civilians and foot soldiers. EU vs Russia may not be fought on German territory any soon, but civil wars inside the EU are not that far away (hell, they're hunting down jews and black people already)... Also, I'm not really a supporter of big-caliber shotguns in private hands - but we're not even allowed to own handguns! Fine, not being allowed to carry in public is something I accept and deem necessary, but not even being allowed to possess them is just ridiculous given the huge number of illegal guns.
  - seanflyon 12y ago
    > they're hunting down jews and black people already What are you talking about?

Crito 12y ago

At least drones tend to have cameras, and their operators cannot excuse their own actions by claiming that their lives were at risk. Drones have the potential to be more audit-able.