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You said it was most certainly rebels mistaking one plane for another. Why are you certain? Do you know how various anti-aircraft weapons work or have you just

by eps 12y ago

You said it was most certainly rebels mistaking one plane for another. Why are you certain? Do you know how various anti-aircraft weapons work or have you just assumed there's a blinking "target acquired" message and a red Launch button? Unless you are an expert in this field, you have no reason to dispense "certain" opinions. That's the point.

TazeTSchnitzel 12y ago
I did say that, and I stand by that. I would imagine the Ukrainians and Russians would be smart enough to use the usual channels to check what the plane was before trying to shoot it down. The Ukrainians, in particular, would be aware that commercial flight paths covered the area, given that the Ukrainian government coördinates the country's airspace.
personZ 12y ago
Are you an expert? In another comment you made the extraordinary claim, substantiated by absolutely no one and no organization of any authority at all (just the standard conspiracy noise and rhetoric that is simply deplorable. It is the domain of the worst, and appears immediately after any event), that the plane was shot down by Ukranian fighter jets. Which...wow. Your credibility among most intellectual people sits somewhere around "none". The general notion is that these were people operating a weapon system they had limited knowledge of, and motivated by their success the day earlier were a little trigger happy. And FWIW, most weapon systems do not tell you what kind of aircraft you're pointing at (this isn't the movies). Recall the USS Vincennes, with the most advanced fire control system in the world at the time (certainly far more advanced than this unit), shooting down an Iranian jetliner that was ascending and squawking civilian airliner transponder codes. I would find a study of the brains of conspiracy fanatics fascinating. There is something fundamentally broken there.
- eps 12y ago
  For one I didn't say it was shot down by Ukrainian fighter jets, don't put words in my mouth. For two, nowhere did I say it was certain or obvious. I did not claim it either. Watch your arguments, bud. And personal attacks? Please.
tim333 12y ago
Well the 'rebels' posted boasting about shooting down a plane at the time MH17 was shot down and even posted a video though they seem to have thought it was a military plane. That seems like fairly clear evidence to me. A more interesting and uncertain question is whether they are actually rebels. The main guy organising it is a colonel from Moscow (Igor Strelkov) who officially retired last year but quite likely is reporting to Moscow still rather than rebelling. Here's an article in the Daily Mail - sorry about the quality of the paper. Still facts are facts. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696389/That-blast-look-smoke-Sick-boast-laughing-rebels-saw-MH17-hit-missile-hours-leader-boasted-We-warned-not-fly-sky.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696389/That-blast-l...

by eps 12y ago

TazeTSchnitzel 12y ago

I did say that, and I stand by that. I would imagine the Ukrainians and Russians would be smart enough to use the usual channels to check what the plane was before trying to shoot it down. The Ukrainians, in particular, would be aware that commercial flight paths covered the area, given that the Ukrainian government coördinates the country's airspace.

personZ 12y ago

Are you an expert? In another comment you made the extraordinary claim, substantiated by absolutely no one and no organization of any authority at all (just the standard conspiracy noise and rhetoric that is simply deplorable. It is the domain of the worst, and appears immediately after any event), that the plane was shot down by Ukranian fighter jets. Which...wow. Your credibility among most intellectual people sits somewhere around "none". The general notion is that these were people operating a weapon system they had limited knowledge of, and motivated by their success the day earlier were a little trigger happy. And FWIW, most weapon systems do not tell you what kind of aircraft you're pointing at (this isn't the movies). Recall the USS Vincennes, with the most advanced fire control system in the world at the time (certainly far more advanced than this unit), shooting down an Iranian jetliner that was ascending and squawking civilian airliner transponder codes. I would find a study of the brains of conspiracy fanatics fascinating. There is something fundamentally broken there.

eps 12y ago
For one I didn't say it was shot down by Ukrainian fighter jets, don't put words in my mouth. For two, nowhere did I say it was certain or obvious. I did not claim it either. Watch your arguments, bud. And personal attacks? Please.

tim333 12y ago

Well the 'rebels' posted boasting about shooting down a plane at the time MH17 was shot down and even posted a video though they seem to have thought it was a military plane. That seems like fairly clear evidence to me. A more interesting and uncertain question is whether they are actually rebels. The main guy organising it is a colonel from Moscow (Igor Strelkov) who officially retired last year but quite likely is reporting to Moscow still rather than rebelling. Here's an article in the Daily Mail - sorry about the quality of the paper. Still facts are facts. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696389/That-blast-look-smoke-Sick-boast-laughing-rebels-saw-MH17-hit-missile-hours-leader-boasted-We-warned-not-fly-sky.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696389/That-blast-l...