7 ms·

The U.S. is slowly (and inevitably) becoming Europe, where living with parents while in your 30s is not abnormal.

by johnrob 17y ago

simanyay 17y ago
Do you have any statistics of how many European young people live with their parents? I am interested in 20-25 years age range. I am asking because I have a bunch of friends in Europe and none of them lives with parents. As far as I can tell, their social programs make it much easier to live on their own than, for example, in my home country (Uzbekistan).
- varjag 17y ago
  One can't generalize "European" on this. The difference between, say, Norway and Portugal is colossal.
  - simanyay 17y ago
    My bad. I was talking about basically about Germany and Hungary.
    - varjag 17y ago
      Well, social programs can be a factor in that, but IMHO most of the difference is cultural. In Southern Europe, large, multi-generation households are traditional, much less so in the North.
  - pyre 17y ago
    In the same way that you can't generalize 'US Of A' on anything either. East Coast vs West Coast vs Middle America can vary wildly on different topics.
    - varjag 17y ago
      True, but the USA, unlike Europe, is considered a single nation-state. In European countries there are differences within national borders as well, e.g. northern part of Italy vs Sicily. That said there are definitely great commonalities in Europe that can be generalized, my point was that this metric isn't one of them. And I am actually surprised with the quoted 1/3rd figure for the USA. Might be true but not what I'd expect from my outsiders insight into American culture.
      - pyre 17y ago
        Yea, but a lot of these figures are based on statistics, and sometimes it doesn't take things like the varied socio-economic situations around the USA. I would take figures like this to be more accurate the more localized that they were (i.e. '1/3rd on the West Coast' or '1/3rd in major cities' etc)
- rick888 17y ago
  "I am asking because I have a bunch of friends in Europe and none of them lives with parents. As far as I can tell, their social programs make it much easier to live on their own than, for example, in my home country (Uzbekistan)." Why do we need social programs to live on our own? I am 28 and have been on my own since I got out of college. I was able to find a job within 6 months of graduating that paid me enough to move out (which isn't that expensive in most parts of the US). I think the reason many people in their 20s can't move out is because of credit card debt. I have so many friends that are thousands of dollars in debt..because they decided they needed the latest gadgets. What we need is for more people to take personal responsibility.
  - simanyay 17y ago
    Because it is really helpful for a young person to know that you are protected in case of serious illness, that if you want to have kids, they will be socially protected which means that they will be able to get good education, health care, educational trips and so on without you paying ridiculous premiums, fees and getting into huge debt. It is also really nice to know that the government will take good care of your parents after their retirement. That they will be able to pay bills, travel, get medicare, etc. When this basic stuff figured out, young people feel safe. That said, there is another interesting problem here: when young people feel safe they may become too lazy. And when people get too lazy, society starts to stagnate which is, as far as I understand, a huge problem in some european countries. But that's a completely different thing to discuss.
  - pyre 17y ago
    But we largely live in a consumer society where we are constantly bombarded with messages to 'buy! buy! buy!' Is it any wonder that lots of people fall for the messages? Especially when you have entire companies full of marketing people all trying to figure out a way to convince you that you need their clients' products.
  - ibsulon 17y ago
    It's nice when you are born on second base... Unfortunately, you think it means you hit a double. I have a friend who lived off of pell grants and loans to make it through a degree. He did not have the aptitude for math or science, and came from a very poor family (his father, at 80, still works at a Burger King.) He did not have connections from his family. He did not have any of the life lessons on how to survive in a middle class system. He ended up graduating, and could not find a job of any sort. It's quite possible, had he grown up white, straight, and middle class, that he would have been fine. He tried to go back to school, thinking that this would be the answer. (After all, it delayed loan payback.) In the meantime, he did what he was able to do: sell drugs. He went to graduate school and sold drugs because he couldn't gather the money to move, he couldn't get a job, and he didn't have options that we with privilege do. It's fun to laugh at the whiny white kids who rack up college credit cards and have to stay at home, but personal responsibility only goes so far. (PS -- my friend now has a drug conviction, a risk he ran because of one of the choices he made to survive. He now has even fewer choices.)
barrkel 17y ago
That's a pretty broad generalization of a continent with a lot of variation in cultural patterns, economics of housing markets, structure of workforces, etc. Here are some numbers, from 1994, but should give an illustration of the range: Share of those at age 25-29 still living in parent's home, % Men Women France 22.5 10.3 Germany 28.8 12.7 Great Britain 20.8 10.8 Spain 64.8 47.6 Greece 62.6 32.1 Italy 66.0 44.1 Source: http://www.york.ac.uk/inst/spru/research/nordic/gerdem.pdf http://www.york.ac.uk/inst/spru/research/nordic/gerdem.pdf - it quotes source as EUROSTAT Data by Fernandez-Cordon 1997, itself quoted by Lauterbach and Lüscher 1999, p.430: Lauterbach, Wolfgang and Kurt Lüscher (1999), ’Wer sind die Spätauszieher? Oder: Herkunftsfamilie, Wohnumfeld und die Gründung eines eigenen Haushalts. Eine empirische Untersuchung über das Alter bei der Haushaltsgründung’, in Zeitschrift für Bevölkerungswissenschaft 24 (4), 425-448.
- deleted 17y ago
  [deleted]
  - barrkel 17y ago
    Sorry, filled that in.
- asdlfj2sd33 17y ago
  Interesting, the countries in the sun belt of Europe: Spain, Greece and Italy have the highest live at home rates, they also have some pretty pricey real estate due to demand from Germany, the UK, and other northern Europeans.
  - utku_karatas2 17y ago
    I guess it's more likely about the culture and family values rather than the economic facts when it comes to countries those called to have meditterenean culture (Spain, Greece, Italy and a bunch more). ie. in Turkey a guy is simply not expected to move out until marriage.
- 17y ago
deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
ulvund 17y ago
It doesn't make sense to generalize in that way. It may be true for Spain but it is not true for most European nations.
TriinT 17y ago
That's the most ignorant comment I have read in a long time. You have never been to Scandinavia, I presume. Newsflash: Europe is more than Italy and Spain. Most people in Germany and Scandinavia, for instance, leave their parents' home at 18.

The U.S. is slowly (and inevitably) becoming Europe, where living with parents while in your 30s is not abnormal.

by johnrob 17y ago

The U.S. is slowly (and inevitably) becoming Europe, where living with parents while in your 30s is not abnormal.

Do you have any statistics of how many European young people live with their parents? I am interested in 20-25 years age range. I am asking because I have a bunch of friends in Europe and none of them lives with parents. As far as I can tell, their social programs make it much easier to live on their own than, for example, in my home country (Uzbekistan).

varjag 17y ago
One can't generalize "European" on this. The difference between, say, Norway and Portugal is colossal.
- simanyay 17y ago
  My bad. I was talking about basically about Germany and Hungary.
  - varjag 17y ago
    Well, social programs can be a factor in that, but IMHO most of the difference is cultural. In Southern Europe, large, multi-generation households are traditional, much less so in the North.
- pyre 17y ago
  In the same way that you can't generalize 'US Of A' on anything either. East Coast vs West Coast vs Middle America can vary wildly on different topics.
  - varjag 17y ago
    True, but the USA, unlike Europe, is considered a single nation-state. In European countries there are differences within national borders as well, e.g. northern part of Italy vs Sicily. That said there are definitely great commonalities in Europe that can be generalized, my point was that this metric isn't one of them. And I am actually surprised with the quoted 1/3rd figure for the USA. Might be true but not what I'd expect from my outsiders insight into American culture.
    - pyre 17y ago
      Yea, but a lot of these figures are based on statistics, and sometimes it doesn't take things like the varied socio-economic situations around the USA. I would take figures like this to be more accurate the more localized that they were (i.e. '1/3rd on the West Coast' or '1/3rd in major cities' etc)
rick888 17y ago
"I am asking because I have a bunch of friends in Europe and none of them lives with parents. As far as I can tell, their social programs make it much easier to live on their own than, for example, in my home country (Uzbekistan)." Why do we need social programs to live on our own? I am 28 and have been on my own since I got out of college. I was able to find a job within 6 months of graduating that paid me enough to move out (which isn't that expensive in most parts of the US). I think the reason many people in their 20s can't move out is because of credit card debt. I have so many friends that are thousands of dollars in debt..because they decided they needed the latest gadgets. What we need is for more people to take personal responsibility.
- simanyay 17y ago
  Because it is really helpful for a young person to know that you are protected in case of serious illness, that if you want to have kids, they will be socially protected which means that they will be able to get good education, health care, educational trips and so on without you paying ridiculous premiums, fees and getting into huge debt. It is also really nice to know that the government will take good care of your parents after their retirement. That they will be able to pay bills, travel, get medicare, etc. When this basic stuff figured out, young people feel safe. That said, there is another interesting problem here: when young people feel safe they may become too lazy. And when people get too lazy, society starts to stagnate which is, as far as I understand, a huge problem in some european countries. But that's a completely different thing to discuss.
- pyre 17y ago
  But we largely live in a consumer society where we are constantly bombarded with messages to 'buy! buy! buy!' Is it any wonder that lots of people fall for the messages? Especially when you have entire companies full of marketing people all trying to figure out a way to convince you that you need their clients' products.
- ibsulon 17y ago
  It's nice when you are born on second base... Unfortunately, you think it means you hit a double. I have a friend who lived off of pell grants and loans to make it through a degree. He did not have the aptitude for math or science, and came from a very poor family (his father, at 80, still works at a Burger King.) He did not have connections from his family. He did not have any of the life lessons on how to survive in a middle class system. He ended up graduating, and could not find a job of any sort. It's quite possible, had he grown up white, straight, and middle class, that he would have been fine. He tried to go back to school, thinking that this would be the answer. (After all, it delayed loan payback.) In the meantime, he did what he was able to do: sell drugs. He went to graduate school and sold drugs because he couldn't gather the money to move, he couldn't get a job, and he didn't have options that we with privilege do. It's fun to laugh at the whiny white kids who rack up college credit cards and have to stay at home, but personal responsibility only goes so far. (PS -- my friend now has a drug conviction, a risk he ran because of one of the choices he made to survive. He now has even fewer choices.)

barrkel 17y ago

That's a pretty broad generalization of a continent with a lot of variation in cultural patterns, economics of housing markets, structure of workforces, etc. Here are some numbers, from 1994, but should give an illustration of the range: Share of those at age 25-29 still living in parent's home, % Men Women France 22.5 10.3 Germany 28.8 12.7 Great Britain 20.8 10.8 Spain 64.8 47.6 Greece 62.6 32.1 Italy 66.0 44.1 Source: http://www.york.ac.uk/inst/spru/research/nordic/gerdem.pdf http://www.york.ac.uk/inst/spru/research/nordic/gerdem.pdf - it quotes source as EUROSTAT Data by Fernandez-Cordon 1997, itself quoted by Lauterbach and Lüscher 1999, p.430: Lauterbach, Wolfgang and Kurt Lüscher (1999), ’Wer sind die Spätauszieher? Oder: Herkunftsfamilie, Wohnumfeld und die Gründung eines eigenen Haushalts. Eine empirische Untersuchung über das Alter bei der Haushaltsgründung’, in Zeitschrift für Bevölkerungswissenschaft 24 (4), 425-448.

deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
- barrkel 17y ago
  Sorry, filled that in.
asdlfj2sd33 17y ago
Interesting, the countries in the sun belt of Europe: Spain, Greece and Italy have the highest live at home rates, they also have some pretty pricey real estate due to demand from Germany, the UK, and other northern Europeans.
- utku_karatas2 17y ago
  I guess it's more likely about the culture and family values rather than the economic facts when it comes to countries those called to have meditterenean culture (Spain, Greece, Italy and a bunch more). ie. in Turkey a guy is simply not expected to move out until marriage.
17y ago

deleted 17y ago

[deleted]

ulvund 17y ago

It doesn't make sense to generalize in that way. It may be true for Spain but it is not true for most European nations.

TriinT 17y ago

That's the most ignorant comment I have read in a long time. You have never been to Scandinavia, I presume. Newsflash: Europe is more than Italy and Spain. Most people in Germany and Scandinavia, for instance, leave their parents' home at 18.