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This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and contin

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulation PDF? These folks are clowns.

wmf 12y ago
It sounds like you're saying that if I create something I can simply declare it to be exempt from any laws I don't like. The whole point of laws is that they're not voluntary. As for torrents, there is that thing called copyright law.
- innguest 12y ago
  Yes, and how has copyright law been faring on the face of torrents? What I'm saying is that it's silly to try and regulate things that are mathematically designed to withstand any regulation. I do not believe unenforceable laws are the way to go. If the government prefers that we do things differently then it should lead by example, convince by arguments, etc, just like anyone else. Instead they're acting childishly by passing laws that regulate something they don't even understand, and that ultimately are not amenable to regulation.
  - wmf 12y ago
    it's silly to try and regulate things that are mathematically designed to withstand any regulation So basically a might-makes-right war of all against all. Gotcha. That concept isn't in much favor these days.
  - _delirium 12y ago
    Bitcoin is not "mathematically designed" to withstand regulation. The mathematical aspect of the system involves only its technical operation; it's designed to avoid certain classes of technical attacks on the system. If anything, it's more amenable to certain types of regulation than cash is—paying someone in cash doesn't make an entry in a public blockchain.
wdewind 12y ago
> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor. I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way. Propose, for instance, how HSBC would be prevented from laundering money for literal international terrorists and drug dealers. Or remittances, another Btc enthusiast favorite: do you really think the fees you are paying Western Union are related to flipping bits and not to keeping massive stores of cash, securely, in remote locations? Maybe some day cash wont be necessary, but we are extremely far from that point, and until we are there Btc remittances are essentially useless. > That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. That some part of our culture thinks it is reasonable to create a new currency and not have the government regulate it is laughable.
- slg 12y ago
  >I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way. A large percentage of the Bitcoin community's view on this front appears to be "past regulations have occasionally failed, therefore we shouldn't have any regulations." This makes no sense. It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked.
  - wdewind 12y ago
    > It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked. Couldn't agree more. TLDR: bring back Glass Steagall.
jerf 12y ago
'That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable.' Bwuh? I can not come up with a sensible interpretation of this sentence. And I've tried.
- virtue3 12y ago
  the government has effectively 0 control over bitcoin. They can control the population in the US (or in this case, NY state) that uses it. But outside of that they can get bent.
  - gregr401 12y ago
    The entire premise is to regulate the financial companies leveraging bitcoin in NY, not the protocol.
- murbard2 12y ago
  s/can/may/
GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago
Since when does New York State have their own currency?
blazespin 12y ago
US government can do anything if you live within their borders. I think they outlawed sodomy once.
- brasky 12y ago
  It is still illegal to buy a vibrator unless you have a doctors prescription in some places.

wmf 12y ago

It sounds like you're saying that if I create something I can simply declare it to be exempt from any laws I don't like. The whole point of laws is that they're not voluntary. As for torrents, there is that thing called copyright law.

innguest 12y ago
Yes, and how has copyright law been faring on the face of torrents? What I'm saying is that it's silly to try and regulate things that are mathematically designed to withstand any regulation. I do not believe unenforceable laws are the way to go. If the government prefers that we do things differently then it should lead by example, convince by arguments, etc, just like anyone else. Instead they're acting childishly by passing laws that regulate something they don't even understand, and that ultimately are not amenable to regulation.
- wmf 12y ago
  it's silly to try and regulate things that are mathematically designed to withstand any regulation So basically a might-makes-right war of all against all. Gotcha. That concept isn't in much favor these days.
- _delirium 12y ago
  Bitcoin is not "mathematically designed" to withstand regulation. The mathematical aspect of the system involves only its technical operation; it's designed to avoid certain classes of technical attacks on the system. If anything, it's more amenable to certain types of regulation than cash is—paying someone in cash doesn't make an entry in a public blockchain.

wdewind 12y ago

> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor. I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way. Propose, for instance, how HSBC would be prevented from laundering money for literal international terrorists and drug dealers. Or remittances, another Btc enthusiast favorite: do you really think the fees you are paying Western Union are related to flipping bits and not to keeping massive stores of cash, securely, in remote locations? Maybe some day cash wont be necessary, but we are extremely far from that point, and until we are there Btc remittances are essentially useless. > That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. That some part of our culture thinks it is reasonable to create a new currency and not have the government regulate it is laughable.

slg 12y ago
>I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way. A large percentage of the Bitcoin community's view on this front appears to be "past regulations have occasionally failed, therefore we shouldn't have any regulations." This makes no sense. It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked.
- wdewind 12y ago
  > It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked. Couldn't agree more. TLDR: bring back Glass Steagall.

jerf 12y ago

'That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable.' Bwuh? I can not come up with a sensible interpretation of this sentence. And I've tried.

virtue3 12y ago
the government has effectively 0 control over bitcoin. They can control the population in the US (or in this case, NY state) that uses it. But outside of that they can get bent.
- gregr401 12y ago
  The entire premise is to regulate the financial companies leveraging bitcoin in NY, not the protocol.
murbard2 12y ago
s/can/may/

GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago

Since when does New York State have their own currency?

blazespin 12y ago

US government can do anything if you live within their borders. I think they outlawed sodomy once.

brasky 12y ago
It is still illegal to buy a vibrator unless you have a doctors prescription in some places.