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The F-15 is 42 years old, and yet its still being built, still being upgraded, still being sold and still kicking ass. Same with the Mig-29 and Su-27 which are

by JVIDEL 12y ago

The F-15 is 42 years old, and yet its still being built, still being upgraded, still being sold and still kicking ass. Same with the Mig-29 and Su-27 which are still the mainstay of the Russian forces until the PAK-FA moves into mass production, same situation than the F-15 if you consider the state of the F-22 and F-35 programs right now. Boeing is even building an upgraded F-15 with stealth, and many would-be buyers of the F-35 like South Korea are now considering that 42 year old plane over the brand new model. The countries you name actually DO have an aerospace industry, you should've googled that before. Iran in particular had to create one after the embargo.

commandar 12y ago
>The F-15 is 42 years old, and yet its still being built, still being upgraded, still being sold and still kicking ass. The problem isn't that the designs are old. It's that the physical airframes are old. The entire F-15C fleet has been grounded multiple times in the past decade due to failures related to the sheer age and wear on the airframes in inventory. One of those failures included a plane literally breaking apart in midair during training. http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/28/f15.grounded/ http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/28/f15.grounded/ >Boeing is even building an upgraded F-15 with stealth Boeing put together a demonstrator with some stealth enhancements. To date there have been no buyers and they've been shopping it around for several years.
cstross 12y ago
If you buy a new MiG-29 or Su-27 from Russia, that's not an ex-USSR plane; it's new-build. Ditto buying a new F15-K, as opposed to a 30 year old beater. New planes of these types are not exactly bargain basement items; an F15-K will cost you around $100M, an Su-27 around $32M, an Su-35 about $65M. The Scorpion, at $20M new, is therefore rather cheaper than an F15 or Su-27, unless you hit the second-hand market ... in which case you have the maintenance issues I alluded to. (As for Iran's ability to build jet fighters, the Azarakhsh and Saeqeh look to be partial clones of the old Northrop F-5, and may or may not live up to promises; numbers built of each type are in single digits. The Argentinian military aerospace sector makes the Iranian one look like a front-rank power.)
- JVIDEL 12y ago
  Even then you can upgrade the older Mig-29s. Same with the F-15, even a brand new one shares a lot of technology with the original model from 3 or 4 decades ago. And BTW a brand-new Mig-29K is $30MM, far more bang for your buck than this Scorpion. As for the aerospace industry of those countries again you are missing the point: they would rather invest the billions it would take to buy a decent amount of modern jets in their own companies to grow the local sector than to essentially subsidize foreign conglomerates. Case in point until 1994 Brazil had no domestic-built planes. Now Embraer is an international player in the aerospace industry with exports to many other countries.
  - vonmoltke 12y ago
    > Case in point until 1994 Brazil had no domestic-built planes. Now Embraer is an international player in the aerospace industry with exports to many other countries. Embraer has been building planes for the Brazilian Air Force, both self-designed and licensed-production, since the early 70s.
    - JVIDEL 12y ago
      They assembled kits and built licensed models with slight modifications, the company didn't take off until it was privatized.
      - vonmoltke 12y ago
        The company debuted with the EMB 110 Bandeirante in their product line, which was a 100% Embraer design sold both to domestic air carriers and the Brazilian Air Force.
        JVIDEL 12y ago
        Using a lot of foreign parts and designed by a French engineer brought over just for this project, all bankrolled by the Brazilian state which the next decade suffered a massive inflationary crisis due in part to these forced industrialization strategies. The reality is before the privatization Embraer was pretty much a nobody in the aerospace industry, unlike now.
dba7dba 12y ago
I don't think S Korea is considering additional F-15 anymore.

by JVIDEL 12y ago

commandar 12y ago

>The F-15 is 42 years old, and yet its still being built, still being upgraded, still being sold and still kicking ass. The problem isn't that the designs are old. It's that the physical airframes are old. The entire F-15C fleet has been grounded multiple times in the past decade due to failures related to the sheer age and wear on the airframes in inventory. One of those failures included a plane literally breaking apart in midair during training. http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/28/f15.grounded/ http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/28/f15.grounded/ >Boeing is even building an upgraded F-15 with stealth Boeing put together a demonstrator with some stealth enhancements. To date there have been no buyers and they've been shopping it around for several years.

cstross 12y ago

If you buy a new MiG-29 or Su-27 from Russia, that's not an ex-USSR plane; it's new-build. Ditto buying a new F15-K, as opposed to a 30 year old beater. New planes of these types are not exactly bargain basement items; an F15-K will cost you around $100M, an Su-27 around $32M, an Su-35 about $65M. The Scorpion, at $20M new, is therefore rather cheaper than an F15 or Su-27, unless you hit the second-hand market ... in which case you have the maintenance issues I alluded to. (As for Iran's ability to build jet fighters, the Azarakhsh and Saeqeh look to be partial clones of the old Northrop F-5, and may or may not live up to promises; numbers built of each type are in single digits. The Argentinian military aerospace sector makes the Iranian one look like a front-rank power.)

JVIDEL 12y ago
Even then you can upgrade the older Mig-29s. Same with the F-15, even a brand new one shares a lot of technology with the original model from 3 or 4 decades ago. And BTW a brand-new Mig-29K is $30MM, far more bang for your buck than this Scorpion. As for the aerospace industry of those countries again you are missing the point: they would rather invest the billions it would take to buy a decent amount of modern jets in their own companies to grow the local sector than to essentially subsidize foreign conglomerates. Case in point until 1994 Brazil had no domestic-built planes. Now Embraer is an international player in the aerospace industry with exports to many other countries.
- vonmoltke 12y ago
  > Case in point until 1994 Brazil had no domestic-built planes. Now Embraer is an international player in the aerospace industry with exports to many other countries. Embraer has been building planes for the Brazilian Air Force, both self-designed and licensed-production, since the early 70s.
  - JVIDEL 12y ago
    They assembled kits and built licensed models with slight modifications, the company didn't take off until it was privatized.
    - vonmoltke 12y ago
      The company debuted with the EMB 110 Bandeirante in their product line, which was a 100% Embraer design sold both to domestic air carriers and the Brazilian Air Force.
      - JVIDEL 12y ago
        Using a lot of foreign parts and designed by a French engineer brought over just for this project, all bankrolled by the Brazilian state which the next decade suffered a massive inflationary crisis due in part to these forced industrialization strategies. The reality is before the privatization Embraer was pretty much a nobody in the aerospace industry, unlike now.

dba7dba 12y ago

I don't think S Korea is considering additional F-15 anymore.