5 ms·

Much greater surface area, so that part makes sense at least for flame-based cooking. I doubt it offers any benefit for non-flame-based cooking (elements, ceram

by personZ 12y ago

Much greater surface area, so that part makes sense at least for flame-based cooking. I doubt it offers any benefit for non-flame-based cooking (elements, ceramic, etc. It might actually be a detriment because it would dissipate more energy. It goes both ways). It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins, which makes sense otherwise they'd have uneven thicknesses. That would be a serious cleaning issue.

ZoF 12y ago
>It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins, which makes sense otherwise they'd have uneven thicknesses. That would be a serious cleaning issue. Doesn't look like that at all to me; in fact I think if the inside was finned it would be an immediate no-go for most, for the very reason you've stated.
- personZ 12y ago
  Given that the company goes to enormous lengths to never show or talk about the inside of the pan, I have to assume this is the Achilles heal. If the fins aren't replicated on the inside, then some areas will be mm from the flame, other areas cms (which, as an aside, means an enormous amount of material per pan) -- aluminum is a decent heat conductor, but that would still be a very bad recipe for cookware.
  - slang800 12y ago
    In addition they would be ridiculously expensive to manufacture if the fins were only on the outside. Normally cookware is made on a lathe (http://youtu.be/8uuFWzkRcAg?t=1m12s http://youtu.be/8uuFWzkRcAg?t=1m12s) or a press from sheet metal. So, if you have areas that are thicker than others you'd need to use an entirely different method of manufacturing them... like casting or welding on the "fins" after the rest of the pot/pan was shaped.
    - Crito 12y ago
      What's up with that guy wearing thick gloves while using that lathe? Isn't not wearing gloves while working with a lathe like rule number one?
      - ertdfgcb 12y ago
        I thought rule number one when working with a lathe is "absolutely no strings or loose clothing at all ever".
        WalterBright 12y ago
        And remember to take the key out of the chuck before turning it on. A kid in my high school metal shop forgot once, and the key punched a nice hole in the wall.
        ertdfgcb 12y ago
        That reminds me of the guy who tried to protect his fingers from the pedestal grinder by using the sleeve of his hoodie instead of walking 20 feet to the tool room to get some gloves. His sleeve got caught at torn completely off. Fortunately he wasn't hurt and banned from the metal shop.
        WalterBright 12y ago
        The drill press in the school shop had a large picture taped next to it of a guy with long hair that had half of it pulled out by a drill press. It was pretty motivating :-)
      - SoftwareMaven 12y ago
        I would imagine the heat of working the metal like that would be enough to be uncomfortable at best. Worse, the edges could be sharp.
    - WatchDog 12y ago
      The article states that the pan is cast aluminium.
  - prawn 12y ago
    Might be wrong, but I suspect they don't show the inside because it looks like a normal saucepan and it's the futuristic exterior that likely gets them sales. Just can't see how a saucepan with those fins inside would be at all useful, whether they're far more efficient or not. Couldn't stir a sauce or easily cook pasta, etc?
    - colanderman 12y ago
      They could show the pan at a slight angle. Someone has to have told them their doubt about the inside.
Crito 12y ago
> "It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins, which makes sense otherwise they'd have uneven thicknesses. That would be a serious cleaning issue." It would also make it nearly impossible to cook anything that needed to be stirred to prevent burning. Stirring a regular pot with a rubber spatula is pretty easy, but getting into all of those nooks? That looks like a royal pain. It's probably alright for things that won't burn though, like soups.
- jessaustin 12y ago
  ...things that won't burn though, like soups. If you can't burn soup you're not trying hard enough! b^)
beemoe 12y ago
>"non-flame-based-cooking" So, methods that don't rely on the convection of air to the pan. I would guess an induction cook top would be a better example than a ceramic element. At a quick glance, if these efficiency percentages being thrown around are actually comparable(maybe not), than induction still beats fancy convection pots even with heatsink bottoms like these: http://www.appliancemagazine.com/editorial.php?article=2257&zone=114&first=1 http://www.appliancemagazine.com/editorial.php?article=2257&... > It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins I couldn't find out if it does. I found others, like the pots in the link above that have a flat inside. My guess is that using a pressure cooker with an induction cooktop fed by on-site solar would be the most efficiency possible, but I have not done the math and would love to be corrected. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_cooking#Efficiency_and_environmental_impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_cooking#Efficiency_a...
- jonah 12y ago
  solar panel > induction cooktop > pressure cooker or just skip the intermediary steps and conversion losses and use a Solar Cooker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cooker https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cooker
NLips 12y ago
It does mean they're covering maybe 60-70% of the UK's market (where this pan is sold) - gas use is very prevalent in the UK due to historically having being cheaper than electricity. I don't see where it looks like there are fins on the inside, and I disagree with your insistence below that it must for heat-transfer reasons - the fins are (relatively) thin, so I'd estimate no point on the inside of the circumference would be several centimetres from the [hot air]. Besides, part of the point of the fins is that they capture heat from the air. Without any math required, if the fin is a reasonable conductor, this means the air is hotter than the fin, which is hotter than the inside of the pan. Where fins join the pan there's a large surface area capturing heat from the air going to a smaller area of pan, compared to gaps between fins where the area in contact with the air is approximately equal to the area of inside pan. edit: [Disclosure] Dr Povey was one of my tutors, and the bearded fellow with glasses in the video was a peer at college (six engineers in my year).

by personZ 12y ago

ZoF 12y ago

>It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins, which makes sense otherwise they'd have uneven thicknesses. That would be a serious cleaning issue. Doesn't look like that at all to me; in fact I think if the inside was finned it would be an immediate no-go for most, for the very reason you've stated.

personZ 12y ago
Given that the company goes to enormous lengths to never show or talk about the inside of the pan, I have to assume this is the Achilles heal. If the fins aren't replicated on the inside, then some areas will be mm from the flame, other areas cms (which, as an aside, means an enormous amount of material per pan) -- aluminum is a decent heat conductor, but that would still be a very bad recipe for cookware.
- slang800 12y ago
  In addition they would be ridiculously expensive to manufacture if the fins were only on the outside. Normally cookware is made on a lathe (http://youtu.be/8uuFWzkRcAg?t=1m12s http://youtu.be/8uuFWzkRcAg?t=1m12s) or a press from sheet metal. So, if you have areas that are thicker than others you'd need to use an entirely different method of manufacturing them... like casting or welding on the "fins" after the rest of the pot/pan was shaped.
  - Crito 12y ago
    What's up with that guy wearing thick gloves while using that lathe? Isn't not wearing gloves while working with a lathe like rule number one?
    - ertdfgcb 12y ago
      I thought rule number one when working with a lathe is "absolutely no strings or loose clothing at all ever".
      - WalterBright 12y ago
        And remember to take the key out of the chuck before turning it on. A kid in my high school metal shop forgot once, and the key punched a nice hole in the wall.
        ertdfgcb 12y ago
        That reminds me of the guy who tried to protect his fingers from the pedestal grinder by using the sleeve of his hoodie instead of walking 20 feet to the tool room to get some gloves. His sleeve got caught at torn completely off. Fortunately he wasn't hurt and banned from the metal shop.
        WalterBright 12y ago
        The drill press in the school shop had a large picture taped next to it of a guy with long hair that had half of it pulled out by a drill press. It was pretty motivating :-)
    - SoftwareMaven 12y ago
      I would imagine the heat of working the metal like that would be enough to be uncomfortable at best. Worse, the edges could be sharp.
  - WatchDog 12y ago
    The article states that the pan is cast aluminium.
- prawn 12y ago
  Might be wrong, but I suspect they don't show the inside because it looks like a normal saucepan and it's the futuristic exterior that likely gets them sales. Just can't see how a saucepan with those fins inside would be at all useful, whether they're far more efficient or not. Couldn't stir a sauce or easily cook pasta, etc?
  - colanderman 12y ago
    They could show the pan at a slight angle. Someone has to have told them their doubt about the inside.

Crito 12y ago

> "It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins, which makes sense otherwise they'd have uneven thicknesses. That would be a serious cleaning issue." It would also make it nearly impossible to cook anything that needed to be stirred to prevent burning. Stirring a regular pot with a rubber spatula is pretty easy, but getting into all of those nooks? That looks like a royal pain. It's probably alright for things that won't burn though, like soups.

jessaustin 12y ago
...things that won't burn though, like soups. If you can't burn soup you're not trying hard enough! b^)

beemoe 12y ago

>"non-flame-based-cooking" So, methods that don't rely on the convection of air to the pan. I would guess an induction cook top would be a better example than a ceramic element. At a quick glance, if these efficiency percentages being thrown around are actually comparable(maybe not), than induction still beats fancy convection pots even with heatsink bottoms like these: http://www.appliancemagazine.com/editorial.php?article=2257&zone=114&first=1 http://www.appliancemagazine.com/editorial.php?article=2257&... > It looks like the inside of the pan has the same fins I couldn't find out if it does. I found others, like the pots in the link above that have a flat inside. My guess is that using a pressure cooker with an induction cooktop fed by on-site solar would be the most efficiency possible, but I have not done the math and would love to be corrected. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_cooking#Efficiency_and_environmental_impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_cooking#Efficiency_a...

jonah 12y ago
solar panel > induction cooktop > pressure cooker or just skip the intermediary steps and conversion losses and use a Solar Cooker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cooker https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cooker

NLips 12y ago

It does mean they're covering maybe 60-70% of the UK's market (where this pan is sold) - gas use is very prevalent in the UK due to historically having being cheaper than electricity. I don't see where it looks like there are fins on the inside, and I disagree with your insistence below that it must for heat-transfer reasons - the fins are (relatively) thin, so I'd estimate no point on the inside of the circumference would be several centimetres from the [hot air]. Besides, part of the point of the fins is that they capture heat from the air. Without any math required, if the fin is a reasonable conductor, this means the air is hotter than the fin, which is hotter than the inside of the pan. Where fins join the pan there's a large surface area capturing heat from the air going to a smaller area of pan, compared to gaps between fins where the area in contact with the air is approximately equal to the area of inside pan. edit: [Disclosure] Dr Povey was one of my tutors, and the bearded fellow with glasses in the video was a peer at college (six engineers in my year).