6 ms·

Microsoft pushes for single global patent system

7 points by nreece 17y ago

electromagnetic 17y ago
And ulterior motives abound. The only reason for a single global patent system is to reinforce the powers of the patent hogs to quash innovation by smaller companies.
- snprbob86 17y ago
  I'm willing to bet that this has more to do with the time, money, and risk associated with global patent searches, applications, and portfolio management. Microsoft is sued over patents far more frequently than it sues; it is a difficult problem space.
  - JulianMorrison 17y ago
    Their effort would be better spent working to get software patent laws globally repealed.
    - snprbob86 17y ago
      That seems like an unrealistic goal. There are many arguments in favor of patent systems and a motion for repeal would face insurmountable opposition. I suspect this to be particularly true of non-software industries. The design processes that would go into the development of a global patent system would likely re-examine and re-evaluate the principals, successes, and failures of many existing patent systems around the world. In all likelihood, the resulting system would be sufficiently less painful to justify tolerating the inherent problems with patent systems for many more years to come.
      - ZeroGravitas 17y ago
        Maybe the post got edited, but you're replying to a suggestion to repeal only "software patents". This is not impossible, indeed many places don't even have them in the first place.
        snprbob86 17y ago
        scratches head I don't recall it saying "software" before, but I don't want to throw around acusations of edits. I really wish there was a "history" link next to edited posts.
        deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
        JulianMorrison 17y ago
        Didn't edited posts used to have an asterisk? I'll edit this one to see. Anyhow, software patents was what I remember typing in the above. MS would have no interest in opposing hardware patents.
wildjim 17y ago
I hope it never happens. There are certain Americanisms that have infected other countries patent systems over the years (e.g. software patents) that have done far, far more harm than good AFAICT, especially to the smaller countries that have been strong-armed into efficiently hamstringing their own nascent technology ventures. The appearance that patent law in America is only about leverage against all your competitors with patent lawsuits rather than protecting truly original discoveries (especially those of smaller companies who can't adequately defend themselves against the super-corp's) is an utter travesty. It puts me in mind of the same erosion that allowed us to become part of a worldwide debt economy (i.e. hardly enough real resources to back the debt).
xcombinator 17y ago
Microsoft is not the best company to talk about patents. They are a software company and in a lot of places in the world mathematical concepts, ideas and software could not be patented. This is the main issue Microsoft wants to change making an universal system, in fact what they want is to export the American system over the other countries. Patents favor the powerful, witch get a monopoly, witch makes money to the powerful, who spends money on new patents, new monopolies. That works great for Microsoft(witch was created when USA software patents didn't exist),and maybe some USA states(all world software needs to be done on Seatle or California), but is bad for the rest of the world, we became a colony, like USA were from Britain. Imagine you are not American, you are an intelligent, smart person of the rest of the world. Would you give external people the monopoly over what you make? Am I not going to think because you bought the exclusive right to it?.
gjm11 17y ago
Ugh, lots to dislike in this article. For instance: 1. "a backlog of patent applications internationally was needed to tackle the 3.5 million pending patent applications around the world": er, no, obviously that isn't what he said. 2. Look how they pair the FSF up with the Pirate Party. Is that because c|net thinks the UK Pirate Party is a vital force to be reckoned with in international politics? Or is it because they hope to make anti-software-patent positions look silly by associating them with marginal-sounding groups? Hmmm, tough one. 3. Wanting a globally unified and more efficient patent system is not, in fact, at all the same thing as wanting patents to cover more things. No one benefits from having patents take years between application and grant, for instance. No one benefits -- at least, not in ways any reasonable person could approve of -- from having lots of crappy patents pass examination. (Note: this latter is one of the things Gutierrez complained of. Being from Microsoft does not imply never getting anything right.) I've no idea whether the particular changes Gutierrez wants make any sense, either for Microsoft or for the rest of the world. His blog posting (linked from the c|net article) is a bit too much oh-and-everyone-should-get-a-pony for my liking. But the c|net article seems to me to consist mostly of digressions.

7 points by nreece 17y ago

And ulterior motives abound. The only reason for a single global patent system is to reinforce the powers of the patent hogs to quash innovation by smaller companies.

snprbob86 17y ago
I'm willing to bet that this has more to do with the time, money, and risk associated with global patent searches, applications, and portfolio management. Microsoft is sued over patents far more frequently than it sues; it is a difficult problem space.
- JulianMorrison 17y ago
  Their effort would be better spent working to get software patent laws globally repealed.
  - snprbob86 17y ago
    That seems like an unrealistic goal. There are many arguments in favor of patent systems and a motion for repeal would face insurmountable opposition. I suspect this to be particularly true of non-software industries. The design processes that would go into the development of a global patent system would likely re-examine and re-evaluate the principals, successes, and failures of many existing patent systems around the world. In all likelihood, the resulting system would be sufficiently less painful to justify tolerating the inherent problems with patent systems for many more years to come.
    - ZeroGravitas 17y ago
      Maybe the post got edited, but you're replying to a suggestion to repeal only "software patents". This is not impossible, indeed many places don't even have them in the first place.
      - snprbob86 17y ago
        scratches head I don't recall it saying "software" before, but I don't want to throw around acusations of edits. I really wish there was a "history" link next to edited posts.
        deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
        JulianMorrison 17y ago
        Didn't edited posts used to have an asterisk? I'll edit this one to see. Anyhow, software patents was what I remember typing in the above. MS would have no interest in opposing hardware patents.

wildjim 17y ago

I hope it never happens. There are certain Americanisms that have infected other countries patent systems over the years (e.g. software patents) that have done far, far more harm than good AFAICT, especially to the smaller countries that have been strong-armed into efficiently hamstringing their own nascent technology ventures. The appearance that patent law in America is only about leverage against all your competitors with patent lawsuits rather than protecting truly original discoveries (especially those of smaller companies who can't adequately defend themselves against the super-corp's) is an utter travesty. It puts me in mind of the same erosion that allowed us to become part of a worldwide debt economy (i.e. hardly enough real resources to back the debt).

xcombinator 17y ago

Microsoft is not the best company to talk about patents. They are a software company and in a lot of places in the world mathematical concepts, ideas and software could not be patented. This is the main issue Microsoft wants to change making an universal system, in fact what they want is to export the American system over the other countries. Patents favor the powerful, witch get a monopoly, witch makes money to the powerful, who spends money on new patents, new monopolies. That works great for Microsoft(witch was created when USA software patents didn't exist),and maybe some USA states(all world software needs to be done on Seatle or California), but is bad for the rest of the world, we became a colony, like USA were from Britain. Imagine you are not American, you are an intelligent, smart person of the rest of the world. Would you give external people the monopoly over what you make? Am I not going to think because you bought the exclusive right to it?.

gjm11 17y ago

Ugh, lots to dislike in this article. For instance: 1. "a backlog of patent applications internationally was needed to tackle the 3.5 million pending patent applications around the world": er, no, obviously that isn't what he said. 2. Look how they pair the FSF up with the Pirate Party. Is that because c|net thinks the UK Pirate Party is a vital force to be reckoned with in international politics? Or is it because they hope to make anti-software-patent positions look silly by associating them with marginal-sounding groups? Hmmm, tough one. 3. Wanting a globally unified and more efficient patent system is not, in fact, at all the same thing as wanting patents to cover more things. No one benefits from having patents take years between application and grant, for instance. No one benefits -- at least, not in ways any reasonable person could approve of -- from having lots of crappy patents pass examination. (Note: this latter is one of the things Gutierrez complained of. Being from Microsoft does not imply never getting anything right.) I've no idea whether the particular changes Gutierrez wants make any sense, either for Microsoft or for the rest of the world. His blog posting (linked from the c|net article) is a bit too much oh-and-everyone-should-get-a-pony for my liking. But the c|net article seems to me to consist mostly of digressions.