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I think it's a general problem of large organizations disconnected to their output, of which the US Army is one. So are most large public universities. When t

I think it's a general problem of large organizations disconnected to their output, of which the US Army is one. So are most large public universities. When there is a large gap between the payer and the user of activities, and an organization has a monopoly or competitive moat, then inefficiency and rot happens.

pjc50 12y ago
Indeed. A control system without enough feedback. Bring back organisational cybernetics! However, saying "gap between the payer and the user of activities" suggests that you might think a market solution would work. For the military this makes no sense and cannot work; protection is necessarily collective. It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested.
- presidentender 12y ago
  >It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested. That 'seeming' may stem from your sources of information on those libertarians. Places like lewrockwell.com and the von Mises institute have railed against military spending for as long as I know.
  - unhammer 12y ago
    Eh, people probably shouldn't recommend lewrockwell.com if they want to be taken seriously, e.g.: http://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/07/no_author/whats-in-vaccines/ http://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/07/no_author/whats-in-vaccin... (which even manages to repeat the popular conflating of quicksilver vs mercury bound as a part of a compound – maybe we should stop drinking water since it contains highly flammable hydrogen. Oh, and highly flammable oxygen.)
- vgharl 12y ago
  > It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested. Of all the people you pick to blame here, you pick... the libertarians? Really? Really? The guys that have Ron Paul as their spokesman? You know, the guy that has spoken out every chance he gets about military spending and the cost of wars.
- mathattack 12y ago
  I'm not sure traditional free market costs work for the military, I'm just highlighting that problems happen when (sometimes by necessity) you separate payer from beneficiary. The same challenges occur in insurance markets. That said, the military could use a lot more cost-benefit analysis in decisions like what's the best way to organize, and which weapons should be bought relative to each other. (And worry less about forcing suppliers to offer jobs in each senator's state)

pjc50 12y ago

Indeed. A control system without enough feedback. Bring back organisational cybernetics! However, saying "gap between the payer and the user of activities" suggests that you might think a market solution would work. For the military this makes no sense and cannot work; protection is necessarily collective. It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested.

presidentender 12y ago
>It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested. That 'seeming' may stem from your sources of information on those libertarians. Places like lewrockwell.com and the von Mises institute have railed against military spending for as long as I know.
- unhammer 12y ago
  Eh, people probably shouldn't recommend lewrockwell.com if they want to be taken seriously, e.g.: http://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/07/no_author/whats-in-vaccines/ http://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/07/no_author/whats-in-vaccin... (which even manages to repeat the popular conflating of quicksilver vs mercury bound as a part of a compound – maybe we should stop drinking water since it contains highly flammable hydrogen. Oh, and highly flammable oxygen.)
vgharl 12y ago
> It would be nice to set the anti-tax-and-spend libertarians against the military budget, but they don't seem interested. Of all the people you pick to blame here, you pick... the libertarians? Really? Really? The guys that have Ron Paul as their spokesman? You know, the guy that has spoken out every chance he gets about military spending and the cost of wars.
mathattack 12y ago
I'm not sure traditional free market costs work for the military, I'm just highlighting that problems happen when (sometimes by necessity) you separate payer from beneficiary. The same challenges occur in insurance markets. That said, the military could use a lot more cost-benefit analysis in decisions like what's the best way to organize, and which weapons should be bought relative to each other. (And worry less about forcing suppliers to offer jobs in each senator's state)