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Thanks for your comment, I think that it opens a good debate. Two thoughts on my part: The first is a problem with the lack of transparency. The NSA, the Cong

by josu 12y ago

Thanks for your comment, I think that it opens a good debate. Two thoughts on my part: The first is a problem with the lack of transparency. The NSA, the Congress or the POTUS never told American citizens: hey, we are going to be reading your emails in order to keep you save. Are you OK with that? The second is a thought experiment. Would you feel as comfortable as you do with this, if instead of the US doing it, it was Russia, China or even North Korea? And now, to give it a different perspective, remember that the US is one of the countries that has killed the most people in the last 50 years outside of their own territory.

csandreasen 12y ago
I'd answer "no" to both of your questions with some caveats. I'm not okay with the lack of transparency, but I acknowledge that some degree of secrecy needs to be kept to maintain the effectiveness of intelligence operation. As an example, I remember seeing a snippet from an interview once where General Alexander even said they should have been more open with the public about the 215 program (I can't seem to find the link right now). We haven't heard much about the similar e-mail program that was discontinued back in 2011. If Snowden had stopped there, I don't think there would be nearly as much debate. As a counterexample, those dragnet concerns don't apply to PRISM/Section 702, which is targeted exclusively against foreigners. I don't think there was any reason to notify every adversary in the world that our government could get access to their Gmail/Hotmail/Yahoo accounts. Snowden didn't open up a debate there, he unilaterally made a decision on behalf of the American people to reduce the effectiveness of our intelligence services. As for the second thought experiment, no I'm not okay with that, either. That said, espionage is mankind's second oldest profession - they're not going to stop and it's silly to think that shutting down the NSA will somehow cause them to stop. Having an effective intelligence service targeting them is going to do more to keep them in check than voicing my disapproval online.

by josu 12y ago

csandreasen 12y ago

I'd answer "no" to both of your questions with some caveats. I'm not okay with the lack of transparency, but I acknowledge that some degree of secrecy needs to be kept to maintain the effectiveness of intelligence operation. As an example, I remember seeing a snippet from an interview once where General Alexander even said they should have been more open with the public about the 215 program (I can't seem to find the link right now). We haven't heard much about the similar e-mail program that was discontinued back in 2011. If Snowden had stopped there, I don't think there would be nearly as much debate. As a counterexample, those dragnet concerns don't apply to PRISM/Section 702, which is targeted exclusively against foreigners. I don't think there was any reason to notify every adversary in the world that our government could get access to their Gmail/Hotmail/Yahoo accounts. Snowden didn't open up a debate there, he unilaterally made a decision on behalf of the American people to reduce the effectiveness of our intelligence services. As for the second thought experiment, no I'm not okay with that, either. That said, espionage is mankind's second oldest profession - they're not going to stop and it's silly to think that shutting down the NSA will somehow cause them to stop. Having an effective intelligence service targeting them is going to do more to keep them in check than voicing my disapproval online.