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I'd say its quite inaccurate to say that Stirling engines will get you 'off the grid'. You are exchanging one grid, electricity generation and distribution, for

I'd say its quite inaccurate to say that Stirling engines will get you 'off the grid'. You are exchanging one grid, electricity generation and distribution, for another, natural gas production and distribution. Your engine may be physically connected to a residential gas distribution network, or practically connected to the gas industry 'grid' if you are expecting large gas bottles to be trucked to your door every few weeks...

byerley 12y ago
'off the grid' has gotten very overloaded because some people take it to mean the power grid, some people take it to mean all utilities, and some people take it to mean self-sufficiency for extended periods. An engine that could run off a wood-burning fire and was built to last a couple decades would strike me as really neat - this not so much. I suppose other places have more issues with the power grid reliability, but it's presumably more efficient to maintain the current infrastructure than to get one of these into every house. Natural gas is also going to get much more expensive if they ever push fracking regulations through - the current pollution from gas leaks is actually worse than burning an equivalent amount of petroleum.
- eru 12y ago
  Why would you be interested in burning wood? > Natural gas is also going to get much more expensive if they ever push fracking regulations through - the current pollution from gas leaks is actually worse than burning an equivalent amount of petroleum. Interesting. Do you have links to further reading?
  - byerley 12y ago
    > Why would you be interested in burning wood? Something you can stick in a cabin to power odd appliances or a computer and not have to worry about carrying fuel in (not very practical I admit). Simple thermoelectric generators are tricky because you have to maintain the temperature difference - generally only good for brief use or with a battery. > Interesting. Do you have links to further reading? To be honest, it's information I got second hand from some climate researchers I used to work with. I wasn't planning to weigh in with google results, but this blog does a very impressive job of documenting the back and forth with links to papers - http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2013/08/shale-gas-more-or-less-polluting-than-coal/ http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2013/08/shale-gas-more-or-le...
  - ttctciyf 12y ago
    Not really directly supportive of Byerley's point, but this recent Cornell study on gas well leak potential might be of interest: http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2014/06/four-10-wells-forecast-fail-northeastern-pa http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2014/06/four-10-wells-fo... > shale gas wells were six times more likely to leak, compared with conventional wells.
  - maxerickson 12y ago
    One reason people like burning wood is that it is inexpensive. There is also the pie in the sky reason that it is low-infrastructure.
    - tlarkworthy 12y ago
      its also quite carcinogenic http://www.ehhi.org/woodsmoke/health_effects.shtml http://www.ehhi.org/woodsmoke/health_effects.shtml
andrewflnr 12y ago
To me the cool thing about a Stirling engine in the abstract is that it doesn't have to run on natural gas, it can run on anything combustible. They allude to that later on in the article, but it seems like maybe we're not getting the super-flexible versions in the US. If they were selling that, I would definitely consider getting one for my house (when I have a house)
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- gregpilling 12y ago
  They can be run by any heat source, including solar, geothermal, etc
  - sopooneo 12y ago
    That actually confused me. I understand how they can run off of any heat source, but then why is it touted in this article as a heat source? It mentioned that it might be a good idea for a laundry that needs a lot of hot water. But if that's the case, don't you just need an efficient furnace to heat the water regardless? Or is it that this thing can recapture a lot of the energy you're already expending heating up the water by some other means?
    - axman6 12y ago
      AFAIK, a Stirling engine is basically a heat pump, it mopved heat from the heat source to some heatsink using the expansion and ocntraction of air. If you were to run water over the heatsink, you'd probably both heat the water and increase the efficiency of the machine by giving a greater heat differential and greater heat conduction rate. S you could use the heat twice basically; one to move the engine's piston and a second time to heat water.
      - Dave778 12y ago
        stirling engines are also known as hot air engines. there are different models and systems but i have one that already works with the temperature difference between room temperature and my hand temperature. Awesome. There is a german manufacturer under www.boehm-stirling.com that makes really nice stirling motors in different forms like cars, machines and so on.
EdwardDiego 12y ago
You can run them off any heat source - the sun, hot water (e.g., geothermal bores), your log fire etc. etc.
quarterwave 12y ago
This is indeed true. However in quite a few places the practicality of prepaid metal gas cylinders beats installing electric utility lines & meters, ensuring efficient transformers, preventing pilfering/meter tampering, etc.

byerley 12y ago

'off the grid' has gotten very overloaded because some people take it to mean the power grid, some people take it to mean all utilities, and some people take it to mean self-sufficiency for extended periods. An engine that could run off a wood-burning fire and was built to last a couple decades would strike me as really neat - this not so much. I suppose other places have more issues with the power grid reliability, but it's presumably more efficient to maintain the current infrastructure than to get one of these into every house. Natural gas is also going to get much more expensive if they ever push fracking regulations through - the current pollution from gas leaks is actually worse than burning an equivalent amount of petroleum.

eru 12y ago
Why would you be interested in burning wood? > Natural gas is also going to get much more expensive if they ever push fracking regulations through - the current pollution from gas leaks is actually worse than burning an equivalent amount of petroleum. Interesting. Do you have links to further reading?
- byerley 12y ago
  > Why would you be interested in burning wood? Something you can stick in a cabin to power odd appliances or a computer and not have to worry about carrying fuel in (not very practical I admit). Simple thermoelectric generators are tricky because you have to maintain the temperature difference - generally only good for brief use or with a battery. > Interesting. Do you have links to further reading? To be honest, it's information I got second hand from some climate researchers I used to work with. I wasn't planning to weigh in with google results, but this blog does a very impressive job of documenting the back and forth with links to papers - http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2013/08/shale-gas-more-or-less-polluting-than-coal/ http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2013/08/shale-gas-more-or-le...
- ttctciyf 12y ago
  Not really directly supportive of Byerley's point, but this recent Cornell study on gas well leak potential might be of interest: http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2014/06/four-10-wells-forecast-fail-northeastern-pa http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/2014/06/four-10-wells-fo... > shale gas wells were six times more likely to leak, compared with conventional wells.
- maxerickson 12y ago
  One reason people like burning wood is that it is inexpensive. There is also the pie in the sky reason that it is low-infrastructure.
  - tlarkworthy 12y ago
    its also quite carcinogenic http://www.ehhi.org/woodsmoke/health_effects.shtml http://www.ehhi.org/woodsmoke/health_effects.shtml

andrewflnr 12y ago

To me the cool thing about a Stirling engine in the abstract is that it doesn't have to run on natural gas, it can run on anything combustible. They allude to that later on in the article, but it seems like maybe we're not getting the super-flexible versions in the US. If they were selling that, I would definitely consider getting one for my house (when I have a house)

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
gregpilling 12y ago
They can be run by any heat source, including solar, geothermal, etc
- sopooneo 12y ago
  That actually confused me. I understand how they can run off of any heat source, but then why is it touted in this article as a heat source? It mentioned that it might be a good idea for a laundry that needs a lot of hot water. But if that's the case, don't you just need an efficient furnace to heat the water regardless? Or is it that this thing can recapture a lot of the energy you're already expending heating up the water by some other means?
  - axman6 12y ago
    AFAIK, a Stirling engine is basically a heat pump, it mopved heat from the heat source to some heatsink using the expansion and ocntraction of air. If you were to run water over the heatsink, you'd probably both heat the water and increase the efficiency of the machine by giving a greater heat differential and greater heat conduction rate. S you could use the heat twice basically; one to move the engine's piston and a second time to heat water.
    - Dave778 12y ago
      stirling engines are also known as hot air engines. there are different models and systems but i have one that already works with the temperature difference between room temperature and my hand temperature. Awesome. There is a german manufacturer under www.boehm-stirling.com that makes really nice stirling motors in different forms like cars, machines and so on.

EdwardDiego 12y ago

You can run them off any heat source - the sun, hot water (e.g., geothermal bores), your log fire etc. etc.

quarterwave 12y ago

This is indeed true. However in quite a few places the practicality of prepaid metal gas cylinders beats installing electric utility lines & meters, ensuring efficient transformers, preventing pilfering/meter tampering, etc.