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I wonder what does RainLoop use as ‘backend’ for communication with mail servers. Are there standalone libraries that fully support, say, Gmail IMAP features? L

I wonder what does RainLoop use as ‘backend’ for communication with mail servers. Are there standalone libraries that fully support, say, Gmail IMAP features? Libraries one can build a mail management GUI on top of. Last time I updated Apple Mail it included yet a few more fixes specifically for Gmail IMAP support. This makes me think that a compatible enough decent solution requires knocking together something custom at this point.

josteink 12y ago
Are there standalone libraries that fully support, say, Gmail IMAP features? If you have to call them "Gmail IMAP features" they really aren't IMAP at all and it would be better to call them proprietary Google-extensions. Gmail does not follow standard IMAP, and no standard IMAP client can fully interop with Gmail. That's a decision Google made, and you can't blame anyone else for the consequences of that.
- nl 12y ago
  It's been a while since I looked at it, but my impression had been that Gmail does follow IMAP, but some features of Gmail aren't represented in IMAP. A simple example is that IMAP expects a message to be in a single folder but Gmail allows you to use multiple labels. I'm pretty sure that this particular issue had no real impact, but there are others that do (difference in handling deleted messages sounds right?) IMAP has no concept of "Archive", which is a key Gmail feature. I think I remember some talk about how Apple deals with that. I don't think you can blame either Google or Apple or IMAP for this. It's how standards work: good for interop, but don't always deal with innovation well.
  - pjc50 12y ago
    What does the gmail android app do? Does it speak IMAP, IMAP-with-proprietary-extensions, or something else?
    - mike_hearn 12y ago
      It uses a custom protocol. IMAP support in Gmail is there only for interop, if you stick to Google's software it's not used at any point.
- baudehlo 12y ago
  Gmail's IMAP extensions follow the IMAP spec for custom extensions (using X- prefixes). They don't really violate the IMAP spec so much as provide access to gmail's custom features through the IMAP protocol.
- kalleboo 12y ago
  > no standard IMAP client can fully interop with Gmail It's my understanding that no standard (as in, RFC standard) IMAP client can interop with pretty much any widely-used IMAP server. This is a topic that comes up whenever IMAP is discussed on HN. All IMAP clients and servers are full of hacks to deal with specific servers or clients.

josteink 12y ago

Are there standalone libraries that fully support, say, Gmail IMAP features? If you have to call them "Gmail IMAP features" they really aren't IMAP at all and it would be better to call them proprietary Google-extensions. Gmail does not follow standard IMAP, and no standard IMAP client can fully interop with Gmail. That's a decision Google made, and you can't blame anyone else for the consequences of that.

nl 12y ago
It's been a while since I looked at it, but my impression had been that Gmail does follow IMAP, but some features of Gmail aren't represented in IMAP. A simple example is that IMAP expects a message to be in a single folder but Gmail allows you to use multiple labels. I'm pretty sure that this particular issue had no real impact, but there are others that do (difference in handling deleted messages sounds right?) IMAP has no concept of "Archive", which is a key Gmail feature. I think I remember some talk about how Apple deals with that. I don't think you can blame either Google or Apple or IMAP for this. It's how standards work: good for interop, but don't always deal with innovation well.
- pjc50 12y ago
  What does the gmail android app do? Does it speak IMAP, IMAP-with-proprietary-extensions, or something else?
  - mike_hearn 12y ago
    It uses a custom protocol. IMAP support in Gmail is there only for interop, if you stick to Google's software it's not used at any point.
baudehlo 12y ago
Gmail's IMAP extensions follow the IMAP spec for custom extensions (using X- prefixes). They don't really violate the IMAP spec so much as provide access to gmail's custom features through the IMAP protocol.
kalleboo 12y ago
> no standard IMAP client can fully interop with Gmail It's my understanding that no standard (as in, RFC standard) IMAP client can interop with pretty much any widely-used IMAP server. This is a topic that comes up whenever IMAP is discussed on HN. All IMAP clients and servers are full of hacks to deal with specific servers or clients.