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This sounds crazy to Americans, too. This isn't happening everywhere and the only accounts are those like this online.

tinkerrr 12y ago
No, this is happening in most parts of the country. See http://www.cato.org/raidmap http://www.cato.org/raidmap (more "neutral" source welcome, if someone has another information source/raw data link).
- dllthomas 12y ago
  Great link, but worth noting the default view shows raids from the past 30 years.
- stonemetal 12y ago
  2 in 2014, 0 in 2012, 6 in 2011. Don't know what happened to their 2013 data but ~8 in three or four years shows how rare an event it is.
  - dTal 12y ago
    There were not 0 in 2012: http://www.infowars.com/man-dies-in-police-raid-on-wrong-house/ http://www.infowars.com/man-dies-in-police-raid-on-wrong-hou... (Apologies for infowars, but the source - ABC News - inexplicably omits the date) The past 4 years seem anomalous - compare the previous four years: 2010 - 19 2009 - 12 2008 - 22 2007 - 16 Much as I'd like to think Obama has single-handedly reformed all of the police departments in the US, I think it rather more likely there's something wrong with the data.
- jdcarter 12y ago
  I was thinking that "no-knock" raids happened very little around my area (Denver) but this map proved me wrong. While not exactly commonplace, I found several instances of raids in/around Denver based on nothing but a single informant. Some of the news stories were just like the OP--police bust into wrong place and kill someone completely innocent.
- freehunter 12y ago
  In 2014 there have been two. In 2012, none. 2013 isn't even listed as an option. Deaths from cars hitting wildlife happens all around the country but I wouldn't say that's representative of the state of the country, nor do most of the citizens live in fear of this happening. These raids are a problem, yes, but in a thread with a European commenting that they think this represents America, your link doesn't really support the argument that this is true.
  - ssmoot 12y ago
    There was no death in this case (yet). The previous comment was referring to the raids in general (at least how I read it). And those are actually not all that uncommon.
    - freehunter 12y ago
      Yeah I got that. But the link doesn't show it's all that common either. Basically none since 2011, and America is a big country. A handful a year across 330 million people is too many, but not nearly as common as the European and my parent are making it out to be.
      - ssmoot 12y ago
        The raids are very common. Just because people don't die very often doesn't mean they're reasonable. Pointing rifles at innocent people practically indiscriminately ("wrong place, wrong time, now STFU citizen"), not letting parents attend to their scared and/or wounded children... there's just no justification for that. It doesn't make it safer for suspects. It doesn't make it safer for police. It's certainly not safer for bystanders. I'm not the sort to evoke "our fore-fathers", but I seriously doubt a militarized police force who could raid citizen's homes without notice is something they would approve of.
        freehunter 12y ago
        Are you arguing against my point, or against someone else? Your first sentence could be a reply to me, but you're making a claim that contradicts the evidence that I'm arguing against, and you present no new evidence. Just saying "it's common" doesn't make it so. The rest of your post has nothing to do with anything I've said, so I will assume you meant to reply to someone else.
- dTal 12y ago
  Something seems wrong with the data for the past 4 years. 0 is certainly incorrect for 2012 and the previous 4 years average 17 raids/year.
jsmthrowaway 12y ago
A college acquaintance was tackled by a SWAT officer, still blinded from looking directly in surprise at the flash bang that had come through his window, bound with a zip tie, then "accidentally" kicked in the face as they tore his entire apartment from floor to ceiling looking for the cocaine being sold. When they didn't find anything in any room, they started tearing open his bedroom walls with an axe, sure he was hiding the pounds of cocaine somewhere. Turns out they had the address of the apartment correct minus the street. He was at 3033 X, they wanted 3033 Y. They realized this about a half hour into the raid and said "oops, sorry," and simply packed up and left. His story is not in that map. I looked. Another time, I left my apartment to walk to the convenience store across the street and was immediately met with six Springfield (OR) Police officers with weapons drawn and pointed directly at my center mass. I was ordered to kneel, not move, and provide identification, conflicting orders with which I was afraid to comply due to itchy triggers in my face; they ended up pushing my face into the sidewalk and taking the identification themselves. They thought I was a car thief they had been chasing. The fun part of the second story is that they found my press credentials in my wallet first (this was when I worked in television) and a lieutenant magically appeared, apologized extensively, and offered me a bottle of water. She also called a bus to come treat the laceration on my forehead, and gave me her card and said if I had any problems, call her first, and we needn't make a big deal out of this, right? Just a misunderstanding, no big deal. Police get it wrong a lot. Just because it's not near you doesn't mean it's not happening, believe me.
- aestra 12y ago
  >Another time, I left my apartment to walk to the convenience store across the street once and was immediately met with six Springfield (OR) Police officers with weapons drawn, pointed directly at my center mass. I was ordered to kneel, not move, and provide identification, conflicting orders with which I was afraid to comply due to itchy triggers in my face; they ended up pushing my face into the sidewalk and taking the identification themselves. They thought I was a car thief they had been chasing. This happens with surprising frequency from what I hear. I know of a couple people with almost the same story.

No, this is happening in most parts of the country. See http://www.cato.org/raidmap http://www.cato.org/raidmap (more "neutral" source welcome, if someone has another information source/raw data link).

dllthomas 12y ago
Great link, but worth noting the default view shows raids from the past 30 years.
stonemetal 12y ago
2 in 2014, 0 in 2012, 6 in 2011. Don't know what happened to their 2013 data but ~8 in three or four years shows how rare an event it is.
- dTal 12y ago
  There were not 0 in 2012: http://www.infowars.com/man-dies-in-police-raid-on-wrong-house/ http://www.infowars.com/man-dies-in-police-raid-on-wrong-hou... (Apologies for infowars, but the source - ABC News - inexplicably omits the date) The past 4 years seem anomalous - compare the previous four years: 2010 - 19 2009 - 12 2008 - 22 2007 - 16 Much as I'd like to think Obama has single-handedly reformed all of the police departments in the US, I think it rather more likely there's something wrong with the data.
jdcarter 12y ago
I was thinking that "no-knock" raids happened very little around my area (Denver) but this map proved me wrong. While not exactly commonplace, I found several instances of raids in/around Denver based on nothing but a single informant. Some of the news stories were just like the OP--police bust into wrong place and kill someone completely innocent.
freehunter 12y ago
In 2014 there have been two. In 2012, none. 2013 isn't even listed as an option. Deaths from cars hitting wildlife happens all around the country but I wouldn't say that's representative of the state of the country, nor do most of the citizens live in fear of this happening. These raids are a problem, yes, but in a thread with a European commenting that they think this represents America, your link doesn't really support the argument that this is true.
- ssmoot 12y ago
  There was no death in this case (yet). The previous comment was referring to the raids in general (at least how I read it). And those are actually not all that uncommon.
  - freehunter 12y ago
    Yeah I got that. But the link doesn't show it's all that common either. Basically none since 2011, and America is a big country. A handful a year across 330 million people is too many, but not nearly as common as the European and my parent are making it out to be.
    - ssmoot 12y ago
      The raids are very common. Just because people don't die very often doesn't mean they're reasonable. Pointing rifles at innocent people practically indiscriminately ("wrong place, wrong time, now STFU citizen"), not letting parents attend to their scared and/or wounded children... there's just no justification for that. It doesn't make it safer for suspects. It doesn't make it safer for police. It's certainly not safer for bystanders. I'm not the sort to evoke "our fore-fathers", but I seriously doubt a militarized police force who could raid citizen's homes without notice is something they would approve of.
      - freehunter 12y ago
        Are you arguing against my point, or against someone else? Your first sentence could be a reply to me, but you're making a claim that contradicts the evidence that I'm arguing against, and you present no new evidence. Just saying "it's common" doesn't make it so. The rest of your post has nothing to do with anything I've said, so I will assume you meant to reply to someone else.
dTal 12y ago
Something seems wrong with the data for the past 4 years. 0 is certainly incorrect for 2012 and the previous 4 years average 17 raids/year.

jsmthrowaway 12y ago

A college acquaintance was tackled by a SWAT officer, still blinded from looking directly in surprise at the flash bang that had come through his window, bound with a zip tie, then "accidentally" kicked in the face as they tore his entire apartment from floor to ceiling looking for the cocaine being sold. When they didn't find anything in any room, they started tearing open his bedroom walls with an axe, sure he was hiding the pounds of cocaine somewhere. Turns out they had the address of the apartment correct minus the street. He was at 3033 X, they wanted 3033 Y. They realized this about a half hour into the raid and said "oops, sorry," and simply packed up and left. His story is not in that map. I looked. Another time, I left my apartment to walk to the convenience store across the street and was immediately met with six Springfield (OR) Police officers with weapons drawn and pointed directly at my center mass. I was ordered to kneel, not move, and provide identification, conflicting orders with which I was afraid to comply due to itchy triggers in my face; they ended up pushing my face into the sidewalk and taking the identification themselves. They thought I was a car thief they had been chasing. The fun part of the second story is that they found my press credentials in my wallet first (this was when I worked in television) and a lieutenant magically appeared, apologized extensively, and offered me a bottle of water. She also called a bus to come treat the laceration on my forehead, and gave me her card and said if I had any problems, call her first, and we needn't make a big deal out of this, right? Just a misunderstanding, no big deal. Police get it wrong a lot. Just because it's not near you doesn't mean it's not happening, believe me.

aestra 12y ago
>Another time, I left my apartment to walk to the convenience store across the street once and was immediately met with six Springfield (OR) Police officers with weapons drawn, pointed directly at my center mass. I was ordered to kneel, not move, and provide identification, conflicting orders with which I was afraid to comply due to itchy triggers in my face; they ended up pushing my face into the sidewalk and taking the identification themselves. They thought I was a car thief they had been chasing. This happens with surprising frequency from what I hear. I know of a couple people with almost the same story.