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They are in the major east coast cities and some west coast cities. I'm sure they aren't currently viable in plenty of cities, but that doesn't mean the infrast

They are in the major east coast cities and some west coast cities. I'm sure they aren't currently viable in plenty of cities, but that doesn't mean the infrastructure shouldn't be built to allow for bikes.

redthrowaway 12y ago
Are you going to take your kids to school on a bike? Ride in your business suit? Go to Ikea or Costco? Going to ride in from the suburbs? Bikes work as primary transportation for active 20-somethings who live in cities near work. They do not work for the vast majority of people, and never will. Wanting to make cities bike-friendly is fine. Wanting to do so at the expense of the 80% of the population that needs a car is addle-brained.
- rustyconover 12y ago
  Your mindset for all of those questions is mistaken. You're thinking that we all live in vast urban sprawl. A lot of us don't live there. Come see what life is like in a functioning city with good planning and density, like Manhattan. 1. Take your kids to school on a bike? If you're living in a dense metro area, your school in within walking distance. So yes. You could bike there, but more likely you'll walk with them. If they go to a further away school, they'll take the subway or a bus. 2. Ride in a business suit? Yes, I see it all the time with Citibikes. Even on Wall Street. 3. Go to Ikea or Costco? Sure you'll go there, but you'll have your items delivered like any sane person who doesn't live in BFE. 4. Going to ride in from the suburbs? People do it every day. You'd be surprised how many showers and locker rooms are right next to corporate bike rooms. Just because you can't imagine something doesn't mean it isn't normal in another part of the country.
  - ars 12y ago
    We already know it works just fine in Manhattan, but it doesn't work at all is most other cities. Not everyone wants to live in a dense city like Manhattan (or any of NY city).
- quinnchr 12y ago
  I live in one of the worst cities for cycling in the US and I do all of those things regularly. I bike to Costco and Ikea all the time, but sure you do have to get big stuff delivered unless you have a trailer (https://www.bikesatwork.com/blog/move-it-by-bike-moving-service https://www.bikesatwork.com/blog/move-it-by-bike-moving-serv...). I used to commute to downtown from the suburbs daily. When I was young my dad used to bike me to daycare/school all the time. If you need to be somewhere in a suit you bike in pants + undershirt and add the rest when you get there. All of these things are possible, admittedly there is a real limitation of needing to live within a 15-20 mile radius of work. The best data I can find suggests about 23% of commuters have a commute of more than 20 miles. So I would say cycling is a perfectly reasonable solution for the majority of people.
  - ars 12y ago
    > When I was young my dad used to bike me to daycare/school all the time. How did all your siblings fit? Or did your Dad make multiple trips? > live within a 15-20 mile radius of work You really think people want to bike 20 miles? That's going to cost you about 2,000 calories (round trip). That's completely unrealistic for most people. They would have to double their food, plus end up exhausted every day at work. And that's for perfectly flat terrain! (The weirdest part is the extra food costs more than the equivalent gasoline, and produces more CO2.)
    - alphapapa 12y ago
      What is up with the downvoting of perfectly reasonable comments like this? Is there some anti-car mafia on this thread?
    - quinnchr 12y ago
      My dad used a bike seat for me, which was doable since my brother and I were different ages and weren't often going to the same place. There are of course bike trailers for hauling 2-3 children around and don't forget pedicabs which regularly haul around 3-4 adults. After you get used to it you don't really feel exhausted. Yes commuting 20 miles by bike is definitely an upper limit, at least for me, but I do know people with longer bike commutes. So assuming you fuel yourself with pure beef, the most unsustainable food I could find, you'd need about .85 kg to get 2000 calories. On average the production of beef releases about 13.3 kg of CO2 per kg of beef, so we're looking at 11.305 kg of CO2 per commute. The average CO2 produced for a medium sized car is about .5 kg per mile. So for the same 40 mile commute you're looking at around 20 kg of emissions. So even if you choose to only eat the most unsustainable food it's still better than driving. If you switch to pork or poultry you can reduce that 11.305 kg of CO2 by about 75%. Cars just don't even come close.
- Dewie 12y ago
  You gotta love the usual hand-wringing from suburban dads.

redthrowaway 12y ago

Are you going to take your kids to school on a bike? Ride in your business suit? Go to Ikea or Costco? Going to ride in from the suburbs? Bikes work as primary transportation for active 20-somethings who live in cities near work. They do not work for the vast majority of people, and never will. Wanting to make cities bike-friendly is fine. Wanting to do so at the expense of the 80% of the population that needs a car is addle-brained.

rustyconover 12y ago
Your mindset for all of those questions is mistaken. You're thinking that we all live in vast urban sprawl. A lot of us don't live there. Come see what life is like in a functioning city with good planning and density, like Manhattan. 1. Take your kids to school on a bike? If you're living in a dense metro area, your school in within walking distance. So yes. You could bike there, but more likely you'll walk with them. If they go to a further away school, they'll take the subway or a bus. 2. Ride in a business suit? Yes, I see it all the time with Citibikes. Even on Wall Street. 3. Go to Ikea or Costco? Sure you'll go there, but you'll have your items delivered like any sane person who doesn't live in BFE. 4. Going to ride in from the suburbs? People do it every day. You'd be surprised how many showers and locker rooms are right next to corporate bike rooms. Just because you can't imagine something doesn't mean it isn't normal in another part of the country.
- ars 12y ago
  We already know it works just fine in Manhattan, but it doesn't work at all is most other cities. Not everyone wants to live in a dense city like Manhattan (or any of NY city).
quinnchr 12y ago
I live in one of the worst cities for cycling in the US and I do all of those things regularly. I bike to Costco and Ikea all the time, but sure you do have to get big stuff delivered unless you have a trailer (https://www.bikesatwork.com/blog/move-it-by-bike-moving-service https://www.bikesatwork.com/blog/move-it-by-bike-moving-serv...). I used to commute to downtown from the suburbs daily. When I was young my dad used to bike me to daycare/school all the time. If you need to be somewhere in a suit you bike in pants + undershirt and add the rest when you get there. All of these things are possible, admittedly there is a real limitation of needing to live within a 15-20 mile radius of work. The best data I can find suggests about 23% of commuters have a commute of more than 20 miles. So I would say cycling is a perfectly reasonable solution for the majority of people.
- ars 12y ago
  > When I was young my dad used to bike me to daycare/school all the time. How did all your siblings fit? Or did your Dad make multiple trips? > live within a 15-20 mile radius of work You really think people want to bike 20 miles? That's going to cost you about 2,000 calories (round trip). That's completely unrealistic for most people. They would have to double their food, plus end up exhausted every day at work. And that's for perfectly flat terrain! (The weirdest part is the extra food costs more than the equivalent gasoline, and produces more CO2.)
  - alphapapa 12y ago
    What is up with the downvoting of perfectly reasonable comments like this? Is there some anti-car mafia on this thread?
  - quinnchr 12y ago
    My dad used a bike seat for me, which was doable since my brother and I were different ages and weren't often going to the same place. There are of course bike trailers for hauling 2-3 children around and don't forget pedicabs which regularly haul around 3-4 adults. After you get used to it you don't really feel exhausted. Yes commuting 20 miles by bike is definitely an upper limit, at least for me, but I do know people with longer bike commutes. So assuming you fuel yourself with pure beef, the most unsustainable food I could find, you'd need about .85 kg to get 2000 calories. On average the production of beef releases about 13.3 kg of CO2 per kg of beef, so we're looking at 11.305 kg of CO2 per commute. The average CO2 produced for a medium sized car is about .5 kg per mile. So for the same 40 mile commute you're looking at around 20 kg of emissions. So even if you choose to only eat the most unsustainable food it's still better than driving. If you switch to pork or poultry you can reduce that 11.305 kg of CO2 by about 75%. Cars just don't even come close.
Dewie 12y ago
You gotta love the usual hand-wringing from suburban dads.