4 ms·

These stories keep popping up, and they're all very encouraging. There was a post a while back about a startup in St Louis, another about Baltimore. There are

by geebee 12y ago

These stories keep popping up, and they're all very encouraging. There was a post a while back about a startup in St Louis, another about Baltimore. There are a lot of excellent cities out there, and SF really is just too expensive (NY, too, but we're talking about tech). I'm reminded of a quote by Patty Smyth: "New York has closed itself off to the young and the struggling. But there are other cities. Detroit. Poughkeepsie. New York City has been taken away from you. So my advice is: Find a new city." http://gothamist.com/2010/05/03/patti_smith_suggests_finding_anothe.php# http://gothamist.com/2010/05/03/patti_smith_suggests_finding.... I really do think that tech needs to embrace the need to branch out. I understand SF is a great place to fund tech companies, and that VCs (and often CEOs) appear to prefer it. But it is frustrating to see tech elites (I'm talking about the sort of people who get to pick up the phone and vent a bit to the elected leader of the world's largest military about their company's hiring woes) insist that there is a severe shortage of tech workers when they continue to create 110k a year jobs in a city where the median 3br house costs 1.1mil. I agree that SF should build more, but this isn't going to be the solution. If you're offering 110K a year for developers in Detroit, Poughkeepsie, Baltimore, St Louis, Minneapolis and you can't find anyone, ok, maybe we can start talking about why and how the government can help. But if you're creating 110K a year jobs in a place where two full time workers are looking at roughly 50k in child care costs and a 1.1 mil bill for the median 3br house, well of course you're having trouble finding workers!

JPKab 12y ago
I wonder how much of SF's growth is forced by VCs, like what happened to my friend who recently got funded. He was DC based, and as a requirement from his VC he had to move to San Fran for a minimum of a year. His conversations with me have been interesting, with the main point being that he has to pay WAY more for talent, space, everything. His main frustration is he doesn't need the mythical "10X" developers. He just needs people who can deliver, and has to fight for talent with dozens of apps which have premises so silly that he can't believe they are funded. I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin. And regarding Austin getting more expensive: There is a huge differentiator here. Austin has a booming housing market AND a booming development market. There is tons of new housing being built, and a lot of it is very interesting, moderate density in-fill development relatively close to the downtown core. There's one company building neo-traditional development neighborhoods in old strip mall locations where the houses all have solar panels and uber modern designs. They go for 270k for a 3 bedroom. Hardly exorbitant.
- dionidium 12y ago
  "I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin." I'm a developer in St. Louis who thinks about this sort of thing all the time. Look, I like San Francisco. I'm there a few times a year and it's great. But is it $60k/year more in cost-of-living better than Kansas City or Austin or Pittsburgh? What if the difference in salary is only half that? I don't know, but I don't think it's obvious.
- bsder 12y ago
  > I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin. This is false. Have you checked actual rents and commutes in Austin rather than silly online calculators. Yes, you get to avoid state tax in Texas. That is the primary advantage. Rents within short commuting distance of downtown are ridiculous. Both IH35 and Mopac(Loop 1) have ridiculous traffic with no mass transit in sight. IH35 through Austin is actually acknowledged as a traffic nightmare in the same class as 101 and 405 in LA! And, finally, you get to live outnumbered and surrounded in a state that wishes Austin would simply vaporize because it's full of "daymn libruls". So, yeah, all that cheap housing is available. It's just a horrible commute from a community that likely hates your guts in a state that doesn't care. Don't get me wrong. There is a lot to like about Austin. But this isn't 1996 when Austin really was 85% the cost of living of the rest of the country when I would fly in from California, buy a $4.95 submarine sandwhich and get back "3 feet" of food because I forgot where I was.
  - big_youth 12y ago
    Your last statement is false. Texas has many large 'liberal' metropolitan cities. The state is now purple and a lot more open than people expect, the majority of the state advocates legalize cannabis and the mayor of Houston is gay. Austin actually used to be known for it's libertarian bent. In fact, there was a discussion on the Austin reddit about this very subject today: http://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/28cmrs/psa_when_you_move_to_austin_you_move_to_texas/?sort=top http://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/28cmrs/psa_when_you_...

by geebee 12y ago

JPKab 12y ago

I wonder how much of SF's growth is forced by VCs, like what happened to my friend who recently got funded. He was DC based, and as a requirement from his VC he had to move to San Fran for a minimum of a year. His conversations with me have been interesting, with the main point being that he has to pay WAY more for talent, space, everything. His main frustration is he doesn't need the mythical "10X" developers. He just needs people who can deliver, and has to fight for talent with dozens of apps which have premises so silly that he can't believe they are funded. I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin. And regarding Austin getting more expensive: There is a huge differentiator here. Austin has a booming housing market AND a booming development market. There is tons of new housing being built, and a lot of it is very interesting, moderate density in-fill development relatively close to the downtown core. There's one company building neo-traditional development neighborhoods in old strip mall locations where the houses all have solar panels and uber modern designs. They go for 270k for a 3 bedroom. Hardly exorbitant.

dionidium 12y ago
"I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin." I'm a developer in St. Louis who thinks about this sort of thing all the time. Look, I like San Francisco. I'm there a few times a year and it's great. But is it $60k/year more in cost-of-living better than Kansas City or Austin or Pittsburgh? What if the difference in salary is only half that? I don't know, but I don't think it's obvious.
bsder 12y ago
> I got an offer the other day for 120k in SF. I did the math, and said no. I'd be better off taking a job for 85k in Austin. This is false. Have you checked actual rents and commutes in Austin rather than silly online calculators. Yes, you get to avoid state tax in Texas. That is the primary advantage. Rents within short commuting distance of downtown are ridiculous. Both IH35 and Mopac(Loop 1) have ridiculous traffic with no mass transit in sight. IH35 through Austin is actually acknowledged as a traffic nightmare in the same class as 101 and 405 in LA! And, finally, you get to live outnumbered and surrounded in a state that wishes Austin would simply vaporize because it's full of "daymn libruls". So, yeah, all that cheap housing is available. It's just a horrible commute from a community that likely hates your guts in a state that doesn't care. Don't get me wrong. There is a lot to like about Austin. But this isn't 1996 when Austin really was 85% the cost of living of the rest of the country when I would fly in from California, buy a $4.95 submarine sandwhich and get back "3 feet" of food because I forgot where I was.
- big_youth 12y ago
  Your last statement is false. Texas has many large 'liberal' metropolitan cities. The state is now purple and a lot more open than people expect, the majority of the state advocates legalize cannabis and the mayor of Houston is gay. Austin actually used to be known for it's libertarian bent. In fact, there was a discussion on the Austin reddit about this very subject today: http://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/28cmrs/psa_when_you_move_to_austin_you_move_to_texas/?sort=top http://www.reddit.com/r/Austin/comments/28cmrs/psa_when_you_...