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OpenMirage and YunoHost looks to me like they serve two completely different audiences/purposes. If an average user (non full-time server admin) wants to set u

OpenMirage and YunoHost looks to me like they serve two completely different audiences/purposes. If an average user (non full-time server admin) wants to set up a server that has common apps like Wordpress, Roundcube and Transmission, YunoHost seems like the OS for the job. How would a user like that go about this with OpenMirage? Is there a similar web interface for setting up mail, web and torrents (for example)? There's a lot of technical documentation, but how would they actually set up these services? After reading the overview link, I'd wager that most users still don't really know why it's better than YunoHost, or even what OpenMirage actually is.

amirmc 12y ago
I'd say that YunoHost only makes sense for people who already know what the words nginx, postfix, LDAP, etc. mean -- I don't consider those people 'average users'. As others on this thread have alluded to, running a server using the existing tools and methods and not being a full-time sysadmin is a recipe for getting pwned. The tools we have right now are porous and difficult to maintain and debug when something goes wrong. Taking a clean-slate approach to the problem can yield new insights and solutions. I don't really mean to suggest that Mirage/Nymote is ready for use by the public right now (I'm supportive of things that give users that option today). However, I do believe it will be better to build self-hosting options using the Mirage stack later, hence the link to the Nymote work.
chubot 12y ago
I think the point is that any system which is meant for people to self-host AND which is based on a Linux distro (Debian, Red Hat, etc. -- YunoHost is based on Debian) is broken by design. Running "sudo apt-get update" and "sudo apt-get upgrade" in a cron job is not a security solution. Operating systems have to be designed so that a security hole in a single application can't compromise the entire system. If not, I would argue they are unsuitable for the average user to "self host". Modern Linux distros don't meet this criteria. OpenMirage is solving some of the same problems as YunoHost, just on a longer time scale and with real solutions rather than hacks piled on top of hacks (I'm not affiliated with the project). apt-get is a big hack and not suitable for distributed computing.

amirmc 12y ago

I'd say that YunoHost only makes sense for people who already know what the words nginx, postfix, LDAP, etc. mean -- I don't consider those people 'average users'. As others on this thread have alluded to, running a server using the existing tools and methods and not being a full-time sysadmin is a recipe for getting pwned. The tools we have right now are porous and difficult to maintain and debug when something goes wrong. Taking a clean-slate approach to the problem can yield new insights and solutions. I don't really mean to suggest that Mirage/Nymote is ready for use by the public right now (I'm supportive of things that give users that option today). However, I do believe it will be better to build self-hosting options using the Mirage stack later, hence the link to the Nymote work.

chubot 12y ago

I think the point is that any system which is meant for people to self-host AND which is based on a Linux distro (Debian, Red Hat, etc. -- YunoHost is based on Debian) is broken by design. Running "sudo apt-get update" and "sudo apt-get upgrade" in a cron job is not a security solution. Operating systems have to be designed so that a security hole in a single application can't compromise the entire system. If not, I would argue they are unsuitable for the average user to "self host". Modern Linux distros don't meet this criteria. OpenMirage is solving some of the same problems as YunoHost, just on a longer time scale and with real solutions rather than hacks piled on top of hacks (I'm not affiliated with the project). apt-get is a big hack and not suitable for distributed computing.