6 ms·

Pharo: a Smalltalk VM that doesn't look like a toy out of the box

48 points by henning 17y ago

icey 17y ago
I'm not a huge smalltalk user, but I really really like Pharo. It feels much more developer friendly than the default Squeak VM.
wmf 17y ago
Is this basically Squeak with an "uncanny valley" OS X theme?
- henning 17y ago
  It's Squeak with a better default look and feel and more pragmatic, mature development goals.
  - icey 17y ago
    IIRC it's removed some of the non-development related stuff as well (like etoys).
    - mcantelon 17y ago
      The sooner they can get rid of all the horrible Squeak graphics the better. Was playing with Pharo last night and, unfortunately, it still doesn't take long to run into Squeak aesthetics.
      - DamienCassou 17y ago
        We are working hard on it. We need more people to help us. Feel free to join.
        mcantelon 17y ago
        Thanks Damien. Pharo is definitely a much-needed project.
  - midnightmonster 17y ago
    So will it run seaside?
    - henning 17y ago
      Seaside is developed in Pharo, so yes.
      - midnightmonster 17y ago
        shows how much I know. Thanks.
joshu 17y ago
out of curiosity, why do we need a GUI to go with a runtime?
- mbrubeck 17y ago
  Typical Smalltalk environments are interesting because the runtime and the development tools are very tightly integrated (or "coupled" depending on your point of view). This affects the way the development and debugging tools interact with programs. For example, you can change a program just by modifying elements of its UI while it's running. For a Smalltalk without a graphical environment by default, try GNU Smalltalk: http://smalltalk.gnu.org/ http://smalltalk.gnu.org/
gcv 17y ago
It runs on an iPhone? Odd; last I checked, the SDK's license forbade compilers and interpreters.
- wmf 17y ago
  Maybe it's targeted at people who like to write unshippable software. But seriously, I think Apple only forbids shipping something called an interpreter or an interpreter that loads code over the Net.
- delackner 17y ago
  Looking at their success stories page, this app: http://www.mobilewikiserver.com/Welcome.html http://www.mobilewikiserver.com/Welcome.html appears to have been created in Pharo and has a little "Available on the App Store" badge. Apple really only seems to reject apps that allow you to get access to an interpreter/compiler, in a way that makes them nervous (flash).
mhd 17y ago
Another nice recent Squeak distribution is Cuis, which takes quite another approach, trying to slim down the system to its basics, going back to the SmallTalk roots. Looks quite interesting for those interested in learning stuff, and doesn't try to go the futile way of trying to emulate "normal" operating systems: http://www.jvuletich.org/Cuis/Index.html http://www.jvuletich.org/Cuis/Index.html
stcredzero 17y ago
What happened to the Squeak wxWidgets binding?

48 points by henning 17y ago

icey 17y ago

I'm not a huge smalltalk user, but I really really like Pharo. It feels much more developer friendly than the default Squeak VM.

wmf 17y ago

Is this basically Squeak with an "uncanny valley" OS X theme?

henning 17y ago
It's Squeak with a better default look and feel and more pragmatic, mature development goals.
- icey 17y ago
  IIRC it's removed some of the non-development related stuff as well (like etoys).
  - mcantelon 17y ago
    The sooner they can get rid of all the horrible Squeak graphics the better. Was playing with Pharo last night and, unfortunately, it still doesn't take long to run into Squeak aesthetics.
    - DamienCassou 17y ago
      We are working hard on it. We need more people to help us. Feel free to join.
      - mcantelon 17y ago
        Thanks Damien. Pharo is definitely a much-needed project.
- midnightmonster 17y ago
  So will it run seaside?
  - henning 17y ago
    Seaside is developed in Pharo, so yes.
    - midnightmonster 17y ago
      shows how much I know. Thanks.

joshu 17y ago

out of curiosity, why do we need a GUI to go with a runtime?

mbrubeck 17y ago
Typical Smalltalk environments are interesting because the runtime and the development tools are very tightly integrated (or "coupled" depending on your point of view). This affects the way the development and debugging tools interact with programs. For example, you can change a program just by modifying elements of its UI while it's running. For a Smalltalk without a graphical environment by default, try GNU Smalltalk: http://smalltalk.gnu.org/ http://smalltalk.gnu.org/

gcv 17y ago

It runs on an iPhone? Odd; last I checked, the SDK's license forbade compilers and interpreters.

wmf 17y ago
Maybe it's targeted at people who like to write unshippable software. But seriously, I think Apple only forbids shipping something called an interpreter or an interpreter that loads code over the Net.
delackner 17y ago
Looking at their success stories page, this app: http://www.mobilewikiserver.com/Welcome.html http://www.mobilewikiserver.com/Welcome.html appears to have been created in Pharo and has a little "Available on the App Store" badge. Apple really only seems to reject apps that allow you to get access to an interpreter/compiler, in a way that makes them nervous (flash).

mhd 17y ago

Another nice recent Squeak distribution is Cuis, which takes quite another approach, trying to slim down the system to its basics, going back to the SmallTalk roots. Looks quite interesting for those interested in learning stuff, and doesn't try to go the futile way of trying to emulate "normal" operating systems: http://www.jvuletich.org/Cuis/Index.html http://www.jvuletich.org/Cuis/Index.html

stcredzero 17y ago

What happened to the Squeak wxWidgets binding?