4 ms·

I've lived in Los Angeles in 2004, and I liked this article a lot. But I think there's another aspect that I think the OP overlooked: The dominant industry he

by nhashem 12y ago

I've lived in Los Angeles in 2004, and I liked this article a lot. But I think there's another aspect that I think the OP overlooked: The dominant industry here will always be Hollywood, where the price of failure can be literally devastating. If your startup fails in the Bay Area, it's not too hard to become a line engineer at another company. If your hedge fund fails in NYC, it's not too hard to get another job at another fund, PE firm, or commercial bank. In some cases, these "failures" are looked at as badges of honor, and likely gave you a lot of hands-on experience you can directly apply to your next job. But if you fail in Hollywood, you're looking at however many years lost of your life, when you were making no appreciable money as a bartender or barista, with likely no applicable skills to any other industry. I found it amusing the OP described LA rent as affordable -- which by NYC or SF prices, it definitely is! -- yet LA also has the worst income/rent ratio of any city in the US, by far[0]. This is not due to rent being too high, but due to income being too low, because everyone here is broke while they're trying to write screenplays and go on auditions. It's really hard to live here without having friends involved in the entertainment industry, so in other words, it's really hard not to see this up close. And even if your friends work on the production or post-production side, it's not much better. At least you have a steady salary, but you're probably also working for a huge megacorp studio that literally embodies every single Office Space cliche. Or you're working for a production or post-production vendor that has to jump through ridiculous hoops and work ridiculous hours to get business from said studios. And while that steady salary is nice, it's still not nearly enough if you want to ever actually do own property some day. So, I wonder how much of that also tempers the goals and dreams for LA startup entrepreneurs. I know it's something I think about often. [0] http://www.zillow.com/research/rent-affordability-2013q4-6681/ http://www.zillow.com/research/rent-affordability-2013q4-668...

cbsmith 12y ago
I dunnoh. I've actually found the entertainment industry has treated their tech employees pretty poorly, and I've been able to make rent by working for actual tech companies. Seems to be an easier way to pay the bills in LA.
akbar501 12y ago
> The dominant industry here will always be Hollywood Hollywood is the #6 industry in LA by output. #1 is real estate. In terms of employment, the government is the largest employer, followed by universities (UCLA/USC), medical (Cedars-Sinai/Kaiser) and then Fox (the #7 employer).
- henrikschroder 12y ago
  Yes, but Hollywood is the fuel for those other industries, not the other way around.
- ekianjo 12y ago
  > In terms of employment, the government is the largest employer Really ? Is that the only state like that, and why is it so in California?
  - rdl 12y ago
    Pretty normal for government to be the largest single employer, outside smaller towns or cities with one huge employer.
  - wavefunction 12y ago
    Texas is another state that derives a great deal of its employment from the Federal government. Lots of military bases in both states.
- waterlesscloud 12y ago
  Which has zero to do with what the dominant industry is.
jonnathanson 12y ago
True; it's pretty much impossible to succeed in business in LA without engaging with Hollywood in some fashion or another. (Unless you're in real estate, I suppose.) Even the startups in LA regularly meet with, and receive funding from, celebrities, big talent agencies, and media companies. That said, I don't think there's a failure stigma attached to startup life in LA the way there is to acting or writing. If you're pushing 35 as an actor and you haven't caught a big break, you're seen as damaged goods -- and you've got a resume with 10+ years of food service on it. Not a fantastic place to end up. But if you tried and failed at a startup or two, and you have marketable skills? Very different story. Fox, Disney, etc., will probably hire you. So will other startups. So will Activision or various other game companies, if you have the stomach for that lifestyle. To your point, though, life at those big companies isn't much like life at Google or Facebook. That's because they aren't tech companies, and tech is a side business for them. In some companies, and in some divisions, life can downright suck. But some of those companies are making bigger commitments to tech, and life as an engineer at Disney (depending on the department) can be pretty solid and well compensated. But if doing a few years at a BigCo while you figure out your next move is "failure," it's a much softer and kinder failure than that which awaits Hollywood hopefuls who never quite make it. On a semi-related note: the key to Hollywood is relationships. It's like DC in that regard. People who come to town with preexisting relationships have a significant advantage. People who don't will need to forge them somehow. While that's not trivial, it's not impossible. As the tech scene grows and matures, so too will access to fellow tech workers, financiers, etc. One of the reasons I'm optimistic about LA is that its tech scene is starting to become self-sufficient, i.e., almost ready to become an independent ecosystem and industry, apart from entertainment or media. It'll always be to the LA tech scene's advantage to maintain ties there. But sooner or later, you'll be able to live and enjoy LA as an engineer without having to play the Hollywood game.
- niels_olson 12y ago
  Isn't SpaceX in LA? What about JPL, etc? Aerospace seems big there.
  - michaelmike 12y ago

by nhashem 12y ago

cbsmith 12y ago

I dunnoh. I've actually found the entertainment industry has treated their tech employees pretty poorly, and I've been able to make rent by working for actual tech companies. Seems to be an easier way to pay the bills in LA.

akbar501 12y ago

> The dominant industry here will always be Hollywood Hollywood is the #6 industry in LA by output. #1 is real estate. In terms of employment, the government is the largest employer, followed by universities (UCLA/USC), medical (Cedars-Sinai/Kaiser) and then Fox (the #7 employer).

henrikschroder 12y ago
Yes, but Hollywood is the fuel for those other industries, not the other way around.
ekianjo 12y ago
> In terms of employment, the government is the largest employer Really ? Is that the only state like that, and why is it so in California?
- rdl 12y ago
  Pretty normal for government to be the largest single employer, outside smaller towns or cities with one huge employer.
- wavefunction 12y ago
  Texas is another state that derives a great deal of its employment from the Federal government. Lots of military bases in both states.
waterlesscloud 12y ago
Which has zero to do with what the dominant industry is.

jonnathanson 12y ago

True; it's pretty much impossible to succeed in business in LA without engaging with Hollywood in some fashion or another. (Unless you're in real estate, I suppose.) Even the startups in LA regularly meet with, and receive funding from, celebrities, big talent agencies, and media companies. That said, I don't think there's a failure stigma attached to startup life in LA the way there is to acting or writing. If you're pushing 35 as an actor and you haven't caught a big break, you're seen as damaged goods -- and you've got a resume with 10+ years of food service on it. Not a fantastic place to end up. But if you tried and failed at a startup or two, and you have marketable skills? Very different story. Fox, Disney, etc., will probably hire you. So will other startups. So will Activision or various other game companies, if you have the stomach for that lifestyle. To your point, though, life at those big companies isn't much like life at Google or Facebook. That's because they aren't tech companies, and tech is a side business for them. In some companies, and in some divisions, life can downright suck. But some of those companies are making bigger commitments to tech, and life as an engineer at Disney (depending on the department) can be pretty solid and well compensated. But if doing a few years at a BigCo while you figure out your next move is "failure," it's a much softer and kinder failure than that which awaits Hollywood hopefuls who never quite make it. On a semi-related note: the key to Hollywood is relationships. It's like DC in that regard. People who come to town with preexisting relationships have a significant advantage. People who don't will need to forge them somehow. While that's not trivial, it's not impossible. As the tech scene grows and matures, so too will access to fellow tech workers, financiers, etc. One of the reasons I'm optimistic about LA is that its tech scene is starting to become self-sufficient, i.e., almost ready to become an independent ecosystem and industry, apart from entertainment or media. It'll always be to the LA tech scene's advantage to maintain ties there. But sooner or later, you'll be able to live and enjoy LA as an engineer without having to play the Hollywood game.

niels_olson 12y ago
Isn't SpaceX in LA? What about JPL, etc? Aerospace seems big there.
- michaelmike 12y ago