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I am constantly struggling with procrastination even though I love my job and what I do. It seems like sometimes I'd rather do anything other than what I'm actu

by dm2 12y ago

I am constantly struggling with procrastination even though I love my job and what I do. It seems like sometimes I'd rather do anything other than what I'm actually suppose to do and what pays the bills, almost like a mental disorder. I've tried setting goals, blocking websites, uninstalling games, creating logs and even creating rewards for doing X amount of work, none of those seem to really help so far. The procrastination article is from 9 years ago and has been posted numerous times before on HN, yet it's at the top of HN. I suspect that procrastination is a horrible problem for programmers due to the vast amount of distraction available via the internet. Also, http://paulgraham.com/distraction.html http://paulgraham.com/distraction.html I'm installing Watch Dogs for the 4th time right now rather than doing my real work (which is very fun, time critical, and offers REAL rewards), wtf is wrong with me.

rdudek 12y ago
I'm in a same boat as you. Between work, family, and house projects, I barely have any time to do anything I want to. So when I do get such time, I blow it on gaming as a form of relaxation. One thing that really helped me was during work hours, if I have downtime, I'll spend it on either searching for new projects to do or learn new things. Once I'm home, my emails stop syncing and I concentrate more on home and family related activities.
_feda_ 12y ago
>It seems like sometimes I'd rather do anything other than what I'm actually suppose to do and what pays the bills, almost like a mental disorder. History is full of geniuses who weren't interested in paying the bills, to the chagrin of their creditors, but ultimately to the benefit of civilization as a whole.
hrvbr 12y ago
From the comments of self-confessed procrastinators, it seems that they're all working more or less alone. We're a social species, our brain is shaped by a million years of tribal lifestyle. Inability to do the work may be a symptom of the loneliness in our modern society.
gbog 12y ago
Hi. Can I be frank? I find it a bit hard to believe that your "real work" is "fun, time critical, and offers REAL rewards". Are you maybe trying to convince yourself here? It happened to me to believe wrongly that I had fun and rewarding tasks at hand. But when I really have such tasks, procrastination is completely out of the way, and I am certainly not on HN to discuss about it. When I have a task that is really interesting to me, I think about it when I shower, before falling asleep, while riding my bike, and when I quickly parse HN (because I have this habit), one of the first five titles will be remotely related and pull some strings, and I'll quickly go back to my code. However, most of the time, I still say (and believe) that my work is "very interesting", "very rewarding", but I procrastinate on HN like everyone else (and right now).
- freshhawk 12y ago
  "But when I really have such tasks, procrastination is completely out of the way" I know for me it doesn't work that way. I assume "REAL rewards" means long lasting meaningful rewards rather than a quick dopamine hit. But hyperbolic discounting [1] is a bitch, so even if I know that once I start some real work it will be engaging and interesting, and tomorrow or next week my happiness will be partly determined by how much of it I got done ... maybe I'll do just one more HN story / Watch Dogs online hacking mission / etc. It's a pattern I recognize and no longer really adversely affects my life like it did when I was younger but I definitely still feel that pull that makes starting things more difficult than it would otherwise be. [1] http://www.damninteresting.com/hyperbolic-discounting/ http://www.damninteresting.com/hyperbolic-discounting/
  - dm2 12y ago
    Do you know exactly what changed for you so that hyperbolic discounting doesn't effect you anymore? Family, discipline, maturity, other specific lifestyle changes?
    - freshhawk 12y ago
      Definitely conscious lifestyle changes. A while ago I decided that a few ingrained bad habits I had needed to go. I changed my lifestyle quite a bit in slow careful steps. The focus was on mindfulness and tracking the progress diligently. I also got really interested in research about habit building and modern scientific views of consciousness. At this point I am still as affected by hyperbolic discounting as ever but I have more of an ability to recognize it for what it is and steer myself towards/trick myself into what my rational self wants to do. I frequently feel like I'm trying to train part of my self (the unified self is an illusion) like I would train a dog.
read 12y ago
Try doing nothing. You wouldn't be able to even if you tried. Your mind would start wandering to topics you haven't let it. Set as a goal that you'll accomplish less every day, and with zero expectation about what to do with the free hours that open up. Just as you pressure yourself to do more, pressure yourself to do less. Try doing nothing and suddenly your subconscious takes over. You discover thoughts you didn't even know were brewing. The fundamental principle underneath is one of balance, and you can trigger it with constraint. Constrain yourself to do nothing and your subconscious will find a way to pull you to something you like. Limit yourself to less, and you start overflowing to a new direction. Like other people said, you look like you are trying to suppress the fact that you don't like what you are doing. The power of a drifting mind can be used positively just as much as it can be used negatively. A writer told me "I didn't get anything done today". Answer: try to do nothing. The best way to have only good days is to not aim at getting anything done. Actually almost everything I've written that has survived was written when I didn't try to get anything done. - Nassim Taleb Make sure you give it enough time. You need at least 1.5-2hr blocks of time where you can shut off the world and play uninterrupted, and you also need to schedule such unstructured play lots of times. Don't worry about feeling unproductive in the meantime. Worry more about noticing the pattern to your thoughts, and do that at the end of each block of time so you don't feel pressured to be noticing. I'd love to hear what you discover.
- dm2 12y ago
  I will try your suggestion this week. Thanks! I like the idea of scheduling play time rather than assuming play comes after work.
- mareofnight 12y ago
  I like this idea. I notice that I tend to get more ideas when I'm stuck waiting for something or doing chores, than when sitting at the computer and reading things is an option.
psychometry 12y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADHD-PI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADHD-PI Would you say this describes you?
- emerongi 12y ago
  I have always found self-diagnosing as idiotic, but honestly, this is 100% me. Can't concentrate on anything, hesitate and procrastinate a lot, also am forgetful. Never had major problems though, always have had good grades for whatever reason. Should I seek help or try to keep it under control myself? I am almost out of school and I feel relieved; so much pressure when you try to concentrate on the topic, but just physically can't. I feel much more comfortable learning the topics I personally like.
  - reitanqild 12y ago
    There are plenty people with ADHD-PI and good grades. Many goes undiagnosed into adult life as well. Seek help. Be prepared to have to explain it a few times. Some doctors are amazingly reluctant to accept that ADHD doesn't mean stupid, lazy or crazy. (Yes, there is a book by about that name. Can't vouch for it yet.) Also, medicine or not, be aware that you might have a few advantages: When everyone else freeze (exam, first to an accident etc) if you are prepared you can think clearly when few others can. You most likely can study very well on your own (but going to class is still recommended just to have an idea of what the school/teacher/professor thinks is important.) Try to use your special abilities like: thinking outside the box (automate things), eye for details (something is fishy), people skills etc. I'd also like to think that a job were you are clearly ON or OFF would be an advantage.
  - psychometry 12y ago
    You might find a 40 hr/week job easier or harder than college in terms of concentration. In any case, there is a clinical procedure for diagnosing types of ADHD if you want to know for sure.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 12y ago
JacobJans 12y ago
When you know exactly what you should be doing, and you know exactly how to do it, then your problem is not going to be solved by more goal setting, "rewards", or blocking websites. It's going to be solved by deciding that you really want to do the thing, and by spending the time to think about why you want to do it, and why it is important. If you don't have a good enough reason to do something, then why would you do it anyways? REAL rewards DO exist for many "boring" tasks, but you have to spend time to actually think about those real rewards. You have to convince yourself, and it won't work if your methods of motivation are "tricks." The real rewards are waiting for you, you've just got to spend the time to identify them before you start the work.
Htsthbjig 12y ago
I recommend you learn from the masters, hear "The Now habit" audiobook, very good for geeks because it teaches you how and why of procastination, not only what to do. blocking websites or installing games do not work if you don't know what procrastination is. In an empty room with nothing to do you could spend time looking at the wall. I will also recommend "the power of full engagement", and also a basic understanding of habits: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYFooE6J1iU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYFooE6J1iU Over time(years) you will master this.
- dm2 12y ago
  Thanks for those videos! I've read/watched similar things before about habits but something just clicked for me that I'd like to try. I'm going to set my main goal as to simply creating the habits, rather than doing X amount work. My goal for the next month is to create habits! This might change everything...

by dm2 12y ago

rdudek 12y ago

I'm in a same boat as you. Between work, family, and house projects, I barely have any time to do anything I want to. So when I do get such time, I blow it on gaming as a form of relaxation. One thing that really helped me was during work hours, if I have downtime, I'll spend it on either searching for new projects to do or learn new things. Once I'm home, my emails stop syncing and I concentrate more on home and family related activities.

_feda_ 12y ago

>It seems like sometimes I'd rather do anything other than what I'm actually suppose to do and what pays the bills, almost like a mental disorder. History is full of geniuses who weren't interested in paying the bills, to the chagrin of their creditors, but ultimately to the benefit of civilization as a whole.

hrvbr 12y ago

From the comments of self-confessed procrastinators, it seems that they're all working more or less alone. We're a social species, our brain is shaped by a million years of tribal lifestyle. Inability to do the work may be a symptom of the loneliness in our modern society.

gbog 12y ago

Hi. Can I be frank? I find it a bit hard to believe that your "real work" is "fun, time critical, and offers REAL rewards". Are you maybe trying to convince yourself here? It happened to me to believe wrongly that I had fun and rewarding tasks at hand. But when I really have such tasks, procrastination is completely out of the way, and I am certainly not on HN to discuss about it. When I have a task that is really interesting to me, I think about it when I shower, before falling asleep, while riding my bike, and when I quickly parse HN (because I have this habit), one of the first five titles will be remotely related and pull some strings, and I'll quickly go back to my code. However, most of the time, I still say (and believe) that my work is "very interesting", "very rewarding", but I procrastinate on HN like everyone else (and right now).

freshhawk 12y ago
"But when I really have such tasks, procrastination is completely out of the way" I know for me it doesn't work that way. I assume "REAL rewards" means long lasting meaningful rewards rather than a quick dopamine hit. But hyperbolic discounting [1] is a bitch, so even if I know that once I start some real work it will be engaging and interesting, and tomorrow or next week my happiness will be partly determined by how much of it I got done ... maybe I'll do just one more HN story / Watch Dogs online hacking mission / etc. It's a pattern I recognize and no longer really adversely affects my life like it did when I was younger but I definitely still feel that pull that makes starting things more difficult than it would otherwise be. [1] http://www.damninteresting.com/hyperbolic-discounting/ http://www.damninteresting.com/hyperbolic-discounting/
- dm2 12y ago
  Do you know exactly what changed for you so that hyperbolic discounting doesn't effect you anymore? Family, discipline, maturity, other specific lifestyle changes?
  - freshhawk 12y ago
    Definitely conscious lifestyle changes. A while ago I decided that a few ingrained bad habits I had needed to go. I changed my lifestyle quite a bit in slow careful steps. The focus was on mindfulness and tracking the progress diligently. I also got really interested in research about habit building and modern scientific views of consciousness. At this point I am still as affected by hyperbolic discounting as ever but I have more of an ability to recognize it for what it is and steer myself towards/trick myself into what my rational self wants to do. I frequently feel like I'm trying to train part of my self (the unified self is an illusion) like I would train a dog.

read 12y ago

Try doing nothing. You wouldn't be able to even if you tried. Your mind would start wandering to topics you haven't let it. Set as a goal that you'll accomplish less every day, and with zero expectation about what to do with the free hours that open up. Just as you pressure yourself to do more, pressure yourself to do less. Try doing nothing and suddenly your subconscious takes over. You discover thoughts you didn't even know were brewing. The fundamental principle underneath is one of balance, and you can trigger it with constraint. Constrain yourself to do nothing and your subconscious will find a way to pull you to something you like. Limit yourself to less, and you start overflowing to a new direction. Like other people said, you look like you are trying to suppress the fact that you don't like what you are doing. The power of a drifting mind can be used positively just as much as it can be used negatively. A writer told me "I didn't get anything done today". Answer: try to do nothing. The best way to have only good days is to not aim at getting anything done. Actually almost everything I've written that has survived was written when I didn't try to get anything done. - Nassim Taleb Make sure you give it enough time. You need at least 1.5-2hr blocks of time where you can shut off the world and play uninterrupted, and you also need to schedule such unstructured play lots of times. Don't worry about feeling unproductive in the meantime. Worry more about noticing the pattern to your thoughts, and do that at the end of each block of time so you don't feel pressured to be noticing. I'd love to hear what you discover.

dm2 12y ago
I will try your suggestion this week. Thanks! I like the idea of scheduling play time rather than assuming play comes after work.
mareofnight 12y ago
I like this idea. I notice that I tend to get more ideas when I'm stuck waiting for something or doing chores, than when sitting at the computer and reading things is an option.

psychometry 12y ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADHD-PI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADHD-PI Would you say this describes you?

emerongi 12y ago
I have always found self-diagnosing as idiotic, but honestly, this is 100% me. Can't concentrate on anything, hesitate and procrastinate a lot, also am forgetful. Never had major problems though, always have had good grades for whatever reason. Should I seek help or try to keep it under control myself? I am almost out of school and I feel relieved; so much pressure when you try to concentrate on the topic, but just physically can't. I feel much more comfortable learning the topics I personally like.
- reitanqild 12y ago
  There are plenty people with ADHD-PI and good grades. Many goes undiagnosed into adult life as well. Seek help. Be prepared to have to explain it a few times. Some doctors are amazingly reluctant to accept that ADHD doesn't mean stupid, lazy or crazy. (Yes, there is a book by about that name. Can't vouch for it yet.) Also, medicine or not, be aware that you might have a few advantages: When everyone else freeze (exam, first to an accident etc) if you are prepared you can think clearly when few others can. You most likely can study very well on your own (but going to class is still recommended just to have an idea of what the school/teacher/professor thinks is important.) Try to use your special abilities like: thinking outside the box (automate things), eye for details (something is fishy), people skills etc. I'd also like to think that a job were you are clearly ON or OFF would be an advantage.
- psychometry 12y ago
  You might find a 40 hr/week job easier or harder than college in terms of concentration. In any case, there is a clinical procedure for diagnosing types of ADHD if you want to know for sure.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
deleted 12y ago

JacobJans 12y ago

When you know exactly what you should be doing, and you know exactly how to do it, then your problem is not going to be solved by more goal setting, "rewards", or blocking websites. It's going to be solved by deciding that you really want to do the thing, and by spending the time to think about why you want to do it, and why it is important. If you don't have a good enough reason to do something, then why would you do it anyways? REAL rewards DO exist for many "boring" tasks, but you have to spend time to actually think about those real rewards. You have to convince yourself, and it won't work if your methods of motivation are "tricks." The real rewards are waiting for you, you've just got to spend the time to identify them before you start the work.

Htsthbjig 12y ago

I recommend you learn from the masters, hear "The Now habit" audiobook, very good for geeks because it teaches you how and why of procastination, not only what to do. blocking websites or installing games do not work if you don't know what procrastination is. In an empty room with nothing to do you could spend time looking at the wall. I will also recommend "the power of full engagement", and also a basic understanding of habits: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYFooE6J1iU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYFooE6J1iU Over time(years) you will master this.

dm2 12y ago
Thanks for those videos! I've read/watched similar things before about habits but something just clicked for me that I'd like to try. I'm going to set my main goal as to simply creating the habits, rather than doing X amount work. My goal for the next month is to create habits! This might change everything...