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I was interested in Buddhism for awhile, and even spent a fair bit of time reading through translated segments of the Pali Cannon. I've seen a critique of Job'

I was interested in Buddhism for awhile, and even spent a fair bit of time reading through translated segments of the Pali Cannon. I've seen a critique of Job's "Buddhism" discussed quite a bit, but it's important to consider that the soteriology of Buddhism and Christianity is radically different. A major difference is the time scale and way with which salvation occurs. Christianity focuses on the realization that Christ is the savior, and appropriate adjustment in behavior in a single life time. Buddhism on the other hand is a progress in realizing the dharma over many lifetimes of effort. Paul's conversion happens instantly on the road to Damascus, his change in action is immediate. The salvation of a bodhisattva occurs over the progress of many lifetimes effort, each new lifetime being shaped by the actions and desires of the old. The point being that the binary saved/damned dichotomy used for judgement in Christian theology (ie X is a bad Christian) doesn't make any sense in a Buddhist context. A "bad buddhist" makes no sense as each person is simply working out the consequences of past actions during each successive lifetime until the dharma is finally realized. (edit: just a note that this 'progress' itself is a massive over simplification itself)

virtualwhys 12y ago
In the same way that there is no single form of Christianity, neither is there a single form of Buddhism. Certainly the above description of Buddhism has nothing at all to do with Soto or Rinzai Zen traditions, which emphasize this life moment as opposed to some later time when one's house will at last be in order. I am not familiar with other forms of Buddhism (not even Zen beyond the tip of the iceburg), but if we go with the extant teachings (particularly in the Diamond Sutra) Buddha negates self, negates reincarnation, and negates awakening. He didn't leave us much to work with O_o
4ccc0f9200a7a 12y ago
Except that Zen is the school of "sudden enlightenment." Suzuki: "Enlightenment is not some good feeling or some particular state of mind. The state of mind that exists when you sit in the right posture is, itself, enlightenment." It's hard to see how being a capitalist overlord is compatible with any reasonable definition of "right livelihood," which is part of the Eightfold Path. Zen is criticized by other Buddhists for its lack of emphasis on ethics. It's hard to see how being a samurai is compatible with "right action," either. I don't think the question of who is or isn't "really" Buddhist is very interesting. I just think it's annoying to act like Steve Jobs is a good example of anything spiritual because he made pretty things at great cost to other people's lives, the planet, human decency, etc.

virtualwhys 12y ago

In the same way that there is no single form of Christianity, neither is there a single form of Buddhism. Certainly the above description of Buddhism has nothing at all to do with Soto or Rinzai Zen traditions, which emphasize this life moment as opposed to some later time when one's house will at last be in order. I am not familiar with other forms of Buddhism (not even Zen beyond the tip of the iceburg), but if we go with the extant teachings (particularly in the Diamond Sutra) Buddha negates self, negates reincarnation, and negates awakening. He didn't leave us much to work with O_o

4ccc0f9200a7a 12y ago

Except that Zen is the school of "sudden enlightenment." Suzuki: "Enlightenment is not some good feeling or some particular state of mind. The state of mind that exists when you sit in the right posture is, itself, enlightenment." It's hard to see how being a capitalist overlord is compatible with any reasonable definition of "right livelihood," which is part of the Eightfold Path. Zen is criticized by other Buddhists for its lack of emphasis on ethics. It's hard to see how being a samurai is compatible with "right action," either. I don't think the question of who is or isn't "really" Buddhist is very interesting. I just think it's annoying to act like Steve Jobs is a good example of anything spiritual because he made pretty things at great cost to other people's lives, the planet, human decency, etc.