4 ms·

I don't think there is any other mainstreamish language with enforced option types. Even Scala and F# just cave and allow nulls everywhere. Swift's constellatio

by chc 12y ago

I don't think there is any other mainstreamish language with enforced option types. Even Scala and F# just cave and allow nulls everywhere. Swift's constellation of features is very interesting IMO.

justin_vanw 12y ago
1. Swift is not a mainstream language. Maybe you trust in Apple's ability to turn it into one. 2. Haskell and Common Lisp, but maybe those aren't "mainstreamish".
- chc 12y ago
  It's the primary language for a huge platform. I don't know how much more mainstream you can get. This seems a bit like saying, "I'm not sure the newly elected US president is a significant figure in US politics." And no, neither Haskell nor Common Lisp are anywhere in the same city as the mainstream. For an idea of what I mean, pick a reasonably significant "target domain" for the language and consider how many major applications are written in that language. There is no platform on which Haskell or Common Lisp get used very much compared to other languages. Objective-C is clearly a dominant presence on iOS, C# rules Windows, Java has a lock on the enterprise, C and C++ are the bosses of systems programming, Haskell is…an interesting language whose motto is "avoid success at all costs." And also, I don't think Common Lisp has enforced option types. (car '(1)) is 1 while (cadr '(1)) is NIL. Am I mistaken?
oscargrouch 12y ago
Rust
- chc 12y ago
  Is the idea of "mainstream" really that vague to people? Rust is the opposite of what I meant by that.
  - oscargrouch 12y ago
    while Swift announcement may have caused a lot of hype, im pretty sure its not mainstream by now.. So Rust just fits into your concept of "mainstream", thats why i've cited it :)
    - chc 12y ago
      I'll go ahead and quote myself: > [Swift is] the primary language for a huge platform. I don't know how much more mainstream you can get. This seems a bit like saying, "I'm not sure the newly elected US president is a significant figure in US politics." > For an idea of what I mean, pick a reasonably significant "target domain" for the language and consider how many major applications are written in that language. There is no platform on which Haskell or Common Lisp get used very much compared to other languages. Objective-C is clearly a dominant presence on iOS, C# rules Windows, Java has a lock on the enterprise, C and C++ are the bosses of systems programming, Haskell is…an interesting language whose motto is "avoid success at all costs." Rust does not fit into this concept of "mainstream." It is a forgone conclusion that many iOS 8 apps will be written in Swift. Rust has no niche yet.

by chc 12y ago

I don't think there is any other mainstreamish language with enforced option types. Even Scala and F# just cave and allow nulls everywhere. Swift's constellation of features is very interesting IMO.

justin_vanw 12y ago

1. Swift is not a mainstream language. Maybe you trust in Apple's ability to turn it into one. 2. Haskell and Common Lisp, but maybe those aren't "mainstreamish".

chc 12y ago
It's the primary language for a huge platform. I don't know how much more mainstream you can get. This seems a bit like saying, "I'm not sure the newly elected US president is a significant figure in US politics." And no, neither Haskell nor Common Lisp are anywhere in the same city as the mainstream. For an idea of what I mean, pick a reasonably significant "target domain" for the language and consider how many major applications are written in that language. There is no platform on which Haskell or Common Lisp get used very much compared to other languages. Objective-C is clearly a dominant presence on iOS, C# rules Windows, Java has a lock on the enterprise, C and C++ are the bosses of systems programming, Haskell is…an interesting language whose motto is "avoid success at all costs." And also, I don't think Common Lisp has enforced option types. (car '(1)) is 1 while (cadr '(1)) is NIL. Am I mistaken?

oscargrouch 12y ago

Rust

chc 12y ago
Is the idea of "mainstream" really that vague to people? Rust is the opposite of what I meant by that.
- oscargrouch 12y ago
  while Swift announcement may have caused a lot of hype, im pretty sure its not mainstream by now.. So Rust just fits into your concept of "mainstream", thats why i've cited it :)
  - chc 12y ago
    I'll go ahead and quote myself: > [Swift is] the primary language for a huge platform. I don't know how much more mainstream you can get. This seems a bit like saying, "I'm not sure the newly elected US president is a significant figure in US politics." > For an idea of what I mean, pick a reasonably significant "target domain" for the language and consider how many major applications are written in that language. There is no platform on which Haskell or Common Lisp get used very much compared to other languages. Objective-C is clearly a dominant presence on iOS, C# rules Windows, Java has a lock on the enterprise, C and C++ are the bosses of systems programming, Haskell is…an interesting language whose motto is "avoid success at all costs." Rust does not fit into this concept of "mainstream." It is a forgone conclusion that many iOS 8 apps will be written in Swift. Rust has no niche yet.