4 ms·

I'm sorry, but no. If you're depressed, a placebo may improve your outlook and this improved outlook may present itself as a decrease in symptoms which, like I

by blhack 17y ago

I'm sorry, but no. If you're depressed, a placebo may improve your outlook and this improved outlook may present itself as a decrease in symptoms which, like I said, manifest psycologically, but unless you've got something to increase the amount of seratonin in your brain (which is used as a neurotransmitter...this is why depression can present as poor short-term memory, and poor focus) then you're fixing a physical problem with a psychological solution. If this makes somebody feel better, then fantastic for them! I'm sorry for being a bit combative about this...sever mania and depression is something that runs in my family, and debilitating depression and anxiety are something I've dealt with my entire life. Believe me, if there was a placebo-based solution to this, I would be the first person in line to get it... I don't mean to take offense, I know you don't mean any, but saying what you're saying is a bit akin to telling a cancer patient that they need to just get over it.

tsally 17y ago
I don't mean to take offense, I know you don't mean any, but saying what you're saying is a bit akin to telling a cancer patient that they need to just get over it. I hear what you are saying, but I do not think he is being that harsh. The harshest part of his post is this: And it responds very well to therapy, but barely at all to drugs. It might be an overexageration, but the points he makes about the effectiveness of therapy and placebo are good ones. You of course are correct too; chemical imbalance is a valid factor to consider, and something that is correctable via drugs. I don't think you two are on opposite ends of a spectrum here. There is a wide range of possible solutions to depression. :-)
gruseom 17y ago
You're missing the point. Placebos produce real physical effects, as real as those produced by non-placebos.
ars 17y ago
> Believe me, if there was a placebo-based solution to this, I would be the first person in line to get it... If you are taking drugs for this, then you are in line already. Every one I have read about has studies showing it is only slightly more effective than placebos. I really am not trying to say the problem is not real. I'm only saying that placebos are far more effective than you realize. For example some quotes from wikipedia: "Notably, however, a recent Cochrane review of the efficacy of the SSRIs concluded that they were only slightly more effective than placebo for the treatment of people with depression." "A widely-reported meta-analysis combined 35 clinical trials submitted to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) before licensing of four newer antidepressants (including the SSRIs paroxetine and fluoxetine, and two non-SSRI antidepressants nefazodone and venlafaxine). The authors found that although the antidepressants were statistically superior to placebo they did not exceed the NICE criteria for a 'clinically significant' effect. In particular they found that the effect size was very small for moderate depression but increased with severity reaching 'clinical significance' for very severe depression. The relationship between severity and efficacy was attributed to a reduction of the placebo effect in severely depressed patients, rather than an increase in the effect of the medication." (Especially note the last sentence.) Please don't understand this in reverse and assume people should/can do nothing. My point is placebos work, and people should make more use of them. Another thing: just because something is all in your head does not mean it's not real. People often assume that "since a placebo fixed it, it was not real to begin with". NO! That's is NOT the case. The problem was REAL, and the placebo fixed it.
tsally 17y ago
Guys, let's not down vote someone below 1 who is trusting enough to share some personal detail for the benefit of discussion. I think it's the right thing to do, regardless of correctness or lack of correctness.

by blhack 17y ago

tsally 17y ago

I don't mean to take offense, I know you don't mean any, but saying what you're saying is a bit akin to telling a cancer patient that they need to just get over it. I hear what you are saying, but I do not think he is being that harsh. The harshest part of his post is this: And it responds very well to therapy, but barely at all to drugs. It might be an overexageration, but the points he makes about the effectiveness of therapy and placebo are good ones. You of course are correct too; chemical imbalance is a valid factor to consider, and something that is correctable via drugs. I don't think you two are on opposite ends of a spectrum here. There is a wide range of possible solutions to depression. :-)

gruseom 17y ago

You're missing the point. Placebos produce real physical effects, as real as those produced by non-placebos.

ars 17y ago

> Believe me, if there was a placebo-based solution to this, I would be the first person in line to get it... If you are taking drugs for this, then you are in line already. Every one I have read about has studies showing it is only slightly more effective than placebos. I really am not trying to say the problem is not real. I'm only saying that placebos are far more effective than you realize. For example some quotes from wikipedia: "Notably, however, a recent Cochrane review of the efficacy of the SSRIs concluded that they were only slightly more effective than placebo for the treatment of people with depression." "A widely-reported meta-analysis combined 35 clinical trials submitted to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) before licensing of four newer antidepressants (including the SSRIs paroxetine and fluoxetine, and two non-SSRI antidepressants nefazodone and venlafaxine). The authors found that although the antidepressants were statistically superior to placebo they did not exceed the NICE criteria for a 'clinically significant' effect. In particular they found that the effect size was very small for moderate depression but increased with severity reaching 'clinical significance' for very severe depression. The relationship between severity and efficacy was attributed to a reduction of the placebo effect in severely depressed patients, rather than an increase in the effect of the medication." (Especially note the last sentence.) Please don't understand this in reverse and assume people should/can do nothing. My point is placebos work, and people should make more use of them. Another thing: just because something is all in your head does not mean it's not real. People often assume that "since a placebo fixed it, it was not real to begin with". NO! That's is NOT the case. The problem was REAL, and the placebo fixed it.

tsally 17y ago

Guys, let's not down vote someone below 1 who is trusting enough to share some personal detail for the benefit of discussion. I think it's the right thing to do, regardless of correctness or lack of correctness.