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One quote that struck me was this: > For too long, we have taught computer science as an academic discipline (as though all of our students will go on to get P

by 14113 12y ago

One quote that struck me was this: > For too long, we have taught computer science as an academic discipline (as though all of our students will go on to get PhDs and then become CS faculty members) even though for most of us, our students are overwhelmingly seeking careers in which they apply computer science. This attitude strikes me as fundamentally wrong - universities are not and should never be trade schools. The point of a university should be to put you in contact with the cutting edge, and allow you to broaden your horizons, not train you for some specific software development job!

hmpc 12y ago
Agreed. The problem is not CS, it's the popularisation of CS as a gateway into the wonderful and high-paying world of software ninjas/rockstars/gurus/[hype du jour]. Transforming CS into preparation for software development careers would be akin to redoing engineering schools to teach students machining skills: important, yes, but that's what vocational/trade schools are for. If you're going into college, suck it up and learn your math. For everything else there's the documentation.
Ntrails 12y ago
I think there is a balance. Usually the smartest guy in the room still needs to explain how his brilliant insight can be applied to the situation at hand.
scott_s 12y ago
It is well accepted that a student in, say, mechanical engineering is far more likely to go on to be a practicing engineer, and not an academic.
nathas 12y ago
Then why do other engineering disciplines go onto practice in industry? There should be computer science, and then there should be software engineering. One is in the sciences school, one is in an engineering school. I bet the engineering enrollment would be significantly higher.
- acbart 12y ago
  There should be a College of Computing, offering several different majors: "Computer Science", "Software Engineering", "Human-Computer Interaction", and, damn it I want this even if there's only 3 or so people qualified in the world to teach it, "Computer Science Education". They should also offer a 3-credit general elective named "Computational Thinking" that's comparable with an English 101 course.
snowwrestler 12y ago
One can get a university degree in physics, which exposes one to the edge of knowledge and prepares one to proceed toward a Ph.D. and research. Or, one can get a university degree in engineering, which is basically training in the practical application of physics to solving real problems. A physicist can be a good engineer, but they would probably need an on-the-job apprenticeship first. I think there is a parallel with the study of computer science vs. software development.

by 14113 12y ago

hmpc 12y ago

Agreed. The problem is not CS, it's the popularisation of CS as a gateway into the wonderful and high-paying world of software ninjas/rockstars/gurus/[hype du jour]. Transforming CS into preparation for software development careers would be akin to redoing engineering schools to teach students machining skills: important, yes, but that's what vocational/trade schools are for. If you're going into college, suck it up and learn your math. For everything else there's the documentation.

Ntrails 12y ago

I think there is a balance. Usually the smartest guy in the room still needs to explain how his brilliant insight can be applied to the situation at hand.

scott_s 12y ago

It is well accepted that a student in, say, mechanical engineering is far more likely to go on to be a practicing engineer, and not an academic.

nathas 12y ago

Then why do other engineering disciplines go onto practice in industry? There should be computer science, and then there should be software engineering. One is in the sciences school, one is in an engineering school. I bet the engineering enrollment would be significantly higher.

acbart 12y ago
There should be a College of Computing, offering several different majors: "Computer Science", "Software Engineering", "Human-Computer Interaction", and, damn it I want this even if there's only 3 or so people qualified in the world to teach it, "Computer Science Education". They should also offer a 3-credit general elective named "Computational Thinking" that's comparable with an English 101 course.

snowwrestler 12y ago

One can get a university degree in physics, which exposes one to the edge of knowledge and prepares one to proceed toward a Ph.D. and research. Or, one can get a university degree in engineering, which is basically training in the practical application of physics to solving real problems. A physicist can be a good engineer, but they would probably need an on-the-job apprenticeship first. I think there is a parallel with the study of computer science vs. software development.