7 ms·

> this extensibility stuff might be enough to tempt me back to Apple from Android, at last. I am not sure if you are serious or not.

untog 12y ago
Why? The intends system of Android is amazing, and I use it heavily. It was absolutely a blocker for me switching to iOS.
- dirkgently 12y ago
  Yes, Android intends are great, and that's why I was surprised when I read "this extensibility stuff might be enough to tempt me back to Apple from Android". What I meant to ask was, what do you mean by "enough"? Does this mean that: 1. iphone/ios/Apple suddenly provides better extendibility? 2. Would you be able to, say, open a link to any browser of your choice in iphone? If any of the above answers is "no", then, yes, I am not sure if you were serious or not. Hence my comment. (Edited for clarity)
  - threeseed 12y ago
    It came across as being sarcastic hence the down votes. And yes iOS8 does provide better extensibility than it did before and yes you would be able to open content in alternative browsers. Not sure about apps like Mail however.
    - dirkgently 12y ago
      I am fine with the downvotes. It's pretty easy on any Apple/Android/iOS/Google thread. > And yes iOS8 does provide better extensibility than it did before That wasn't my point. I asked specifically if iOS provides better extendibility than _Android_ (as the OP seemed to infer by stating his move back to iOS for that reason alone). > not sure about apps like Mail however. That's the point. Browser was just an example. Extendibility of a system does not mean in one or two places.
      - clarky07 12y ago
        it doesn't have to better, it has to be good enough, which is the point the OP was trying to make. There are some things about Android that are better and there are some things about iOS that are better. Intents were a thing that has been better in the past on Android (by virtue of not existing on iOS), and a reason that some people have stuck with Android even though they might prefer iOS for a lot of things. If the extensions stuff is "good enough" for the reasons people like intents, then that could easily be enough for people to switch from Android to iOS assuming they like iOS better overall.
        dirkgently 12y ago
        But how does anyone one know if they are "good enough" already? Just because Apple published some of it? Or the claim came from actually developing appls that make use of it? I don't think somebody gained the experience within few hours of Apple's event.
        clarky07 12y ago
        You don't. That's why he said "might". Since it's not even out yet, I doubt anyone is buying a device based on the announcement today. We'll find out at some point after they release it and the reviews come in.
  - jasonpbecker 12y ago
    On 1, better than iOS was. Not sure if you mean better than Android, in which case, that remains to be seen. But the target should be "good enough". On 2, third-party apps have long supported opening in a different app. Of course, it's up to that developer to include the x-callback-url and Apple apps won't use that preference.
- criley2 12y ago
  Because third party iOS developers are still second class citizens compared to Apple in-house developers. Google doesn't make third party developers second class citizens: it makes apps using the same tools and apis as available to everyone, and distributes them the same way that everyone else distributes their apps. This is a step forward for Apple, but for example: Safari will remain the only browser available on iOS, and Apple's version of Safari will remain versions ahead of UIWebView meaning that any non-Safari browser will remain inferior by intentional design. True competition is prevented by design, and it takes 5 years to open up something as basic as the keyboard. How many more years until browser is opened up? 5 more? It's an interesting move as far as platforms go, but I know that it's no where near what I want from a platform. It's still locked down, under featured and heavily controlled. For a non-tech user or someone who wants a dead simple phone, it seems great. But for those of us who love our devices, love customizing them in and out, and love trying to create the best experiences, Apple still is not a choice: we can't compete with Apple apps, we can't use their in-house APIs, and they still offer us inferior versions of the software/APIs that they use inhouse.
  - threeseed 12y ago
    > True competition is prevented by design. You really think Apple is threatened by the competition posed by an alternative keyboard or browser ? Pretty sure they care far more about maintaining their "99% of malware" exists on Android record.
    - criley2 12y ago
      Please look past the hype, malware on phones is a near non-issue. Need I remind you that it was iOS devices being hijacked by hackers, not Android devices? Claims like "99% of malware exist on Android" didn't prevent Apple users across the west from having their devices hijacked for ransom. And no, Apple isn't threatened by the "competition". I'm just saying: from the perspective of a tech-forward developer who spends a lot of time on their mobile computing device, the locked down reality of iOS, while marginally improving, is still leagues away from a platform that gives developers a deep and powerful ability to create wonderful mobile experiences that transcend the concept of "sandboxed app". Sure iOS apps have some great modern flat-ui navigation, but how many iOS developers are trying to re-imagine what mobile means, how we use phones? How many iOS developers are capable of adjusting how we use the phone, the screens and service we see the most? On Android: most developers can. I have a list of a dozen apps that improve on Google's core functions, and I'm sure hundreds more amazing apps exist. On iOS: None can and none are, outside of the small jailbreak scene. Everyone uses stock everything because that's all that's allowed. #innovation

untog 12y ago

Why? The intends system of Android is amazing, and I use it heavily. It was absolutely a blocker for me switching to iOS.

dirkgently 12y ago
Yes, Android intends are great, and that's why I was surprised when I read "this extensibility stuff might be enough to tempt me back to Apple from Android". What I meant to ask was, what do you mean by "enough"? Does this mean that: 1. iphone/ios/Apple suddenly provides better extendibility? 2. Would you be able to, say, open a link to any browser of your choice in iphone? If any of the above answers is "no", then, yes, I am not sure if you were serious or not. Hence my comment. (Edited for clarity)
- threeseed 12y ago
  It came across as being sarcastic hence the down votes. And yes iOS8 does provide better extensibility than it did before and yes you would be able to open content in alternative browsers. Not sure about apps like Mail however.
  - dirkgently 12y ago
    I am fine with the downvotes. It's pretty easy on any Apple/Android/iOS/Google thread. > And yes iOS8 does provide better extensibility than it did before That wasn't my point. I asked specifically if iOS provides better extendibility than _Android_ (as the OP seemed to infer by stating his move back to iOS for that reason alone). > not sure about apps like Mail however. That's the point. Browser was just an example. Extendibility of a system does not mean in one or two places.
    - clarky07 12y ago
      it doesn't have to better, it has to be good enough, which is the point the OP was trying to make. There are some things about Android that are better and there are some things about iOS that are better. Intents were a thing that has been better in the past on Android (by virtue of not existing on iOS), and a reason that some people have stuck with Android even though they might prefer iOS for a lot of things. If the extensions stuff is "good enough" for the reasons people like intents, then that could easily be enough for people to switch from Android to iOS assuming they like iOS better overall.
      - dirkgently 12y ago
        But how does anyone one know if they are "good enough" already? Just because Apple published some of it? Or the claim came from actually developing appls that make use of it? I don't think somebody gained the experience within few hours of Apple's event.
        clarky07 12y ago
        You don't. That's why he said "might". Since it's not even out yet, I doubt anyone is buying a device based on the announcement today. We'll find out at some point after they release it and the reviews come in.
- jasonpbecker 12y ago
  On 1, better than iOS was. Not sure if you mean better than Android, in which case, that remains to be seen. But the target should be "good enough". On 2, third-party apps have long supported opening in a different app. Of course, it's up to that developer to include the x-callback-url and Apple apps won't use that preference.
criley2 12y ago
Because third party iOS developers are still second class citizens compared to Apple in-house developers. Google doesn't make third party developers second class citizens: it makes apps using the same tools and apis as available to everyone, and distributes them the same way that everyone else distributes their apps. This is a step forward for Apple, but for example: Safari will remain the only browser available on iOS, and Apple's version of Safari will remain versions ahead of UIWebView meaning that any non-Safari browser will remain inferior by intentional design. True competition is prevented by design, and it takes 5 years to open up something as basic as the keyboard. How many more years until browser is opened up? 5 more? It's an interesting move as far as platforms go, but I know that it's no where near what I want from a platform. It's still locked down, under featured and heavily controlled. For a non-tech user or someone who wants a dead simple phone, it seems great. But for those of us who love our devices, love customizing them in and out, and love trying to create the best experiences, Apple still is not a choice: we can't compete with Apple apps, we can't use their in-house APIs, and they still offer us inferior versions of the software/APIs that they use inhouse.
- threeseed 12y ago
  > True competition is prevented by design. You really think Apple is threatened by the competition posed by an alternative keyboard or browser ? Pretty sure they care far more about maintaining their "99% of malware" exists on Android record.
  - criley2 12y ago
    Please look past the hype, malware on phones is a near non-issue. Need I remind you that it was iOS devices being hijacked by hackers, not Android devices? Claims like "99% of malware exist on Android" didn't prevent Apple users across the west from having their devices hijacked for ransom. And no, Apple isn't threatened by the "competition". I'm just saying: from the perspective of a tech-forward developer who spends a lot of time on their mobile computing device, the locked down reality of iOS, while marginally improving, is still leagues away from a platform that gives developers a deep and powerful ability to create wonderful mobile experiences that transcend the concept of "sandboxed app". Sure iOS apps have some great modern flat-ui navigation, but how many iOS developers are trying to re-imagine what mobile means, how we use phones? How many iOS developers are capable of adjusting how we use the phone, the screens and service we see the most? On Android: most developers can. I have a list of a dozen apps that improve on Google's core functions, and I'm sure hundreds more amazing apps exist. On iOS: None can and none are, outside of the small jailbreak scene. Everyone uses stock everything because that's all that's allowed. #innovation