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Just a quick point. The article says "there is no guarantee whatsoever that google does anything except for changing what they display to you." If you're on th

Just a quick point. The article says "there is no guarantee whatsoever that google does anything except for changing what they display to you." If you're on the page at https://history.google.com/history/ https://history.google.com/history/ and click on the gear and then "Help" the page about deleting search history is at https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/465 https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/465 and it says "What happens to your history when it's deleted When you delete items from your Web History, they are no longer associated with your Google Account. However, Google may store searches in a separate logs system to prevent spam and abuse and to improve our services." The article claims that there's no guarantee that Google does anything other than change the display. Google actually does quite a bit of work to disassociate items from your Google account if/when you delete them.

jacquesm 12y ago
Storing searches in a log to prevent spam sounds pretty disingenuous. So, how about an unambiguous (as in, without weaselwords such as 'may') update to the privacy policy detailing exactly what google stores in a user profile and what it does not, and that what a user sees in the interface mirrors exactly what google sees in its systems minus some small delta for propagation across google's servers? Because what you write above is technically quite possibly true as far as the viewpoint of a user is concerned but leaves open a ton of possibilities for clever/creative interpretation on what 'improve our services' means.
- moultano 12y ago
  What sort of harm are you worried about that this doesn't exclude?
  - jacquesm 12y ago
    I can go and imagine a hundred scenarios that involve some company the size of google in the jurisdiction that it is in leading to some form of abuse but frankly what I can imagine is not relevant, what is relevant is whether or not this is desirable and imnsho it is not. The fact that google creates all kinds of legal loopholes and that the Google Ambassador to HN finds it sufficient to point out that indeed something changes behind the scenes (namely, that google dissociates your searches from your account and nothing more) says enough. I hope that nobody here is naive enough not to see the size of the loopholes that statement creates.
- Matt_Cutts 12y ago
  Why disingenuous? An easy example of preventing spam would be to detect and stop people trying to spam Google Suggest, which is based on queries that users do. Jacques, you wrote an article titled "Google Web/Search History Disable Does Absolutely Nothing." I just wanted to point interested people to Google's public documentation which points out what happens when people delete items from their search history.
  - jacquesm 12y ago
    Right. And you conveniently avoid any discussion about the difference between 'your account' and 'your userprofile' (the data that google stores about a user). So you are essentially confirming the thrust of the article, that as far as your privacy is concerned nothing changes.
    - res0nat0r 12y ago
      These posts are becoming so conspiratorial leaning, that nothing Matt says is going to please you from the sounds of it.
      - jacquesm 12y ago
        What is so conspiratorial about it? One day the google equivalent of Mark Klein will leak a bunch of userprofiles, we'll all be shocked at what's inside and then you'll go 'Oh, I knew that all along'.
        res0nat0r 12y ago
        This is reinforcing my point. No matter what anyone at Google says is going to be enough to make you happy.
        jacquesm 12y ago
        So you're working for google now? In that case maybe update your profile. And if you don't work for google then how does it reinforce your point?
ronaldx 12y ago
What you have said is unconvincing, and gives you quite a lot of wiggle room. by "association with your Google Account", do you include "association with your personal identity"? The description of the server log suggests that your web history will still be easily connected to your personal identity. The claim that Google is doing quite a bit of work to prevent that wouldn't match the privacy policy. by "deleted from Web History", do you include "turned off Web History"? This seems possible but is not explicitly stated. The article says "there is no guarantee whatsoever" and I believe this is no guarantee whatsoever that there is more than a superficial difference.

jacquesm 12y ago

Storing searches in a log to prevent spam sounds pretty disingenuous. So, how about an unambiguous (as in, without weaselwords such as 'may') update to the privacy policy detailing exactly what google stores in a user profile and what it does not, and that what a user sees in the interface mirrors exactly what google sees in its systems minus some small delta for propagation across google's servers? Because what you write above is technically quite possibly true as far as the viewpoint of a user is concerned but leaves open a ton of possibilities for clever/creative interpretation on what 'improve our services' means.

moultano 12y ago
What sort of harm are you worried about that this doesn't exclude?
- jacquesm 12y ago
  I can go and imagine a hundred scenarios that involve some company the size of google in the jurisdiction that it is in leading to some form of abuse but frankly what I can imagine is not relevant, what is relevant is whether or not this is desirable and imnsho it is not. The fact that google creates all kinds of legal loopholes and that the Google Ambassador to HN finds it sufficient to point out that indeed something changes behind the scenes (namely, that google dissociates your searches from your account and nothing more) says enough. I hope that nobody here is naive enough not to see the size of the loopholes that statement creates.
Matt_Cutts 12y ago
Why disingenuous? An easy example of preventing spam would be to detect and stop people trying to spam Google Suggest, which is based on queries that users do. Jacques, you wrote an article titled "Google Web/Search History Disable Does Absolutely Nothing." I just wanted to point interested people to Google's public documentation which points out what happens when people delete items from their search history.
- jacquesm 12y ago
  Right. And you conveniently avoid any discussion about the difference between 'your account' and 'your userprofile' (the data that google stores about a user). So you are essentially confirming the thrust of the article, that as far as your privacy is concerned nothing changes.
  - res0nat0r 12y ago
    These posts are becoming so conspiratorial leaning, that nothing Matt says is going to please you from the sounds of it.
    - jacquesm 12y ago
      What is so conspiratorial about it? One day the google equivalent of Mark Klein will leak a bunch of userprofiles, we'll all be shocked at what's inside and then you'll go 'Oh, I knew that all along'.
      - res0nat0r 12y ago
        This is reinforcing my point. No matter what anyone at Google says is going to be enough to make you happy.
        jacquesm 12y ago
        So you're working for google now? In that case maybe update your profile. And if you don't work for google then how does it reinforce your point?

ronaldx 12y ago

What you have said is unconvincing, and gives you quite a lot of wiggle room. by "association with your Google Account", do you include "association with your personal identity"? The description of the server log suggests that your web history will still be easily connected to your personal identity. The claim that Google is doing quite a bit of work to prevent that wouldn't match the privacy policy. by "deleted from Web History", do you include "turned off Web History"? This seems possible but is not explicitly stated. The article says "there is no guarantee whatsoever" and I believe this is no guarantee whatsoever that there is more than a superficial difference.