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"In the U.S., by contrast, fewer and fewer people are employed in middle-class manufacturing jobs" Isn't this kind of on purpose? I get how we're now bemoanin

"In the U.S., by contrast, fewer and fewer people are employed in middle-class manufacturing jobs" Isn't this kind of on purpose? I get how we're now bemoaning the loss of manufacturing in the US, but before times "got hard" the shift to a services based economy was seen as a good thing. Or at least a good thing as long as the economy was/is healthy. One could argue that it isn't, and that the loss of manufacturing caused the US economic problems but that's another discussion entirely. The article seems like it's conclusions are based on job classifications between two countries that don't tell the entire story.

pessimizer 12y ago
>before times "got hard" the shift to a services based economy was seen as a good thing. More sold as a good thing. The same media outlets that were pushing the 'transition' into services were part of larger conglomerates that stood to benefit from overseas manufacturing.
drzaiusapelord 12y ago
I'd rather have a low level white-collar job than a blue collar one. Running a lathe or changing 200 degree oil in a robotic arm kinda suck compared to rebooting servers or being a powerpoint jockey. Arguably, the white collar job has a career path. Being a lathe guy means staying a lathe guy until your overseas competitors start moving in products at half your cost. Now you're an unemployed lathe guy. Might as well beat them to the punch, move manufacturing overseas, make cheaper things, and get out of the 100 degree factory floor. Now you're both selling $5 stair balusters but yours has better marketing and design on the box and you can interact with buyers in person easily.
- xyzzy123 12y ago
  Or a telephone sanitizer.
- netcan 12y ago
  I would much rather be a welder or even a line worker in a factory than a call centre employee, personally. Though, I'd certainly take living in this decade to living in previous decades. I do think something has been lost though. In a healthy manufacturing area of generations past someone who was 'hardworking and reliable' could get a 'decent' job. The financial rewards, self esteem and such from these jobs were deemed adequate by the people of the times. Get over the hurdle and you can be fine. Today, 'hardworking and reliable' is not really sufficient. Those cookie cutter jobs don't exist. I think politicians are at a loss because it just isn't clear what a person needs to do to qualify them for employment in this world. Some new jobs are highly specialised, like programming. These are hard to get people in to, but at least it sounds possible to train people for them. But, how the hell do you qualify people people who are 32 and have been unemployed for the past 3 years to be social media analysts?
  - drzaiusapelord 12y ago
    Honestly, this just sounds like idealizing the past to me. In reality, factory work was demoralizing and even losing a small customer meant instant layoffs. The idea that things are worse today is fairly ridiculous and tends to reflect people with a certain political axe to grind.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
wutbrodo 12y ago
> One could argue that it isn't, and that the loss of manufacturing caused the US economic problems I've heard a lot of references to how we need to bring manufacturing back, but what's the TL;DR on why they're so necessary? Is it just that they're stable blue-collar jobs? My understanding has been that the issue was that blue-collar jobs aren't economical any more (when competing with automation and workers in poorer countries), but that we failed to educate our population enough that they could fill white-collar jobs. Aside from the national security argument (domestic manufacturing and energy production per se have those advantages), is there something I'm missing about the benefits of manufacturing jobs?

pessimizer 12y ago

>before times "got hard" the shift to a services based economy was seen as a good thing. More sold as a good thing. The same media outlets that were pushing the 'transition' into services were part of larger conglomerates that stood to benefit from overseas manufacturing.

drzaiusapelord 12y ago

I'd rather have a low level white-collar job than a blue collar one. Running a lathe or changing 200 degree oil in a robotic arm kinda suck compared to rebooting servers or being a powerpoint jockey. Arguably, the white collar job has a career path. Being a lathe guy means staying a lathe guy until your overseas competitors start moving in products at half your cost. Now you're an unemployed lathe guy. Might as well beat them to the punch, move manufacturing overseas, make cheaper things, and get out of the 100 degree factory floor. Now you're both selling $5 stair balusters but yours has better marketing and design on the box and you can interact with buyers in person easily.

xyzzy123 12y ago
Or a telephone sanitizer.
netcan 12y ago
I would much rather be a welder or even a line worker in a factory than a call centre employee, personally. Though, I'd certainly take living in this decade to living in previous decades. I do think something has been lost though. In a healthy manufacturing area of generations past someone who was 'hardworking and reliable' could get a 'decent' job. The financial rewards, self esteem and such from these jobs were deemed adequate by the people of the times. Get over the hurdle and you can be fine. Today, 'hardworking and reliable' is not really sufficient. Those cookie cutter jobs don't exist. I think politicians are at a loss because it just isn't clear what a person needs to do to qualify them for employment in this world. Some new jobs are highly specialised, like programming. These are hard to get people in to, but at least it sounds possible to train people for them. But, how the hell do you qualify people people who are 32 and have been unemployed for the past 3 years to be social media analysts?
- drzaiusapelord 12y ago
  Honestly, this just sounds like idealizing the past to me. In reality, factory work was demoralizing and even losing a small customer meant instant layoffs. The idea that things are worse today is fairly ridiculous and tends to reflect people with a certain political axe to grind.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]

wutbrodo 12y ago

> One could argue that it isn't, and that the loss of manufacturing caused the US economic problems I've heard a lot of references to how we need to bring manufacturing back, but what's the TL;DR on why they're so necessary? Is it just that they're stable blue-collar jobs? My understanding has been that the issue was that blue-collar jobs aren't economical any more (when competing with automation and workers in poorer countries), but that we failed to educate our population enough that they could fill white-collar jobs. Aside from the national security argument (domestic manufacturing and energy production per se have those advantages), is there something I'm missing about the benefits of manufacturing jobs?