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This is increasingly becoming a completely unviable option. As more and more distros adopt it as the standard Distros has always had standards and this has nev

This is increasingly becoming a completely unviable option. As more and more distros adopt it as the standard Distros has always had standards and this has never been an issue before. more and more software becomes dependent on it and it's various parts This is something completely different and unrelated from what distros decide to do. For instance, while I really like systemd as a Linux-specific init-system, I cannot for the love of all that is good architecture understand why Gnome, a desktop-environment running on top of X, maybe running on top of Linux, should make it self dependent on a Linux-specific component like systemd. In cases like that you should not hate systemd, but on the guilty party introducing the bad dependency. This is clearly not systemd's fault.

cthalupa 12y ago
>Distros has always had standards and this has never been an issue before. While distros adopting standards has been polarizing in the past, I think this is the most debated issue in the past decade or two. There's been some quibbles over things, and of course there's the vi vs emacs holy wars, etc, but I can't think of a single time where something so integral to the distribution has been such a matter of controversy across the community. >In cases like that you should not hate systemd, but on the guilty party introducing the bad dependency. This is clearly not systemd's fault. Oh, I'm not blaming systemd for this (Though it's not surprising Gnome has done this - the Freedesktop.org group is fairly incestuous when it comes to this sort of thing), I'm just saying it's pretty easy to say "Don't use systemd if you don't like it then!", but increasingly more difficult to actually do it. It's not like vi vs emacs or nginx vs apache where you can quite easily just use the one you want.
bkor 12y ago
> understand why Gnome, a desktop-environment running on top of X, maybe running on top of Linux, should make it self dependent on a Linux-specific component like systemd GNOME doesn't depend on systemd. See for instance a blogpost about it: http://blogs.gnome.org/ovitters/2013/09/25/gnome-and-logindsystemd-thoughts/ http://blogs.gnome.org/ovitters/2013/09/25/gnome-and-loginds.... GNOME wants either logind (systemd) or ConsoleKit (freedesktop.org, unmaintained). Calling people "guilty" is also not very constructive behaviour, IMO. Too emotional while you're already showing lack of knowledge about this subject.

cthalupa 12y ago

>Distros has always had standards and this has never been an issue before. While distros adopting standards has been polarizing in the past, I think this is the most debated issue in the past decade or two. There's been some quibbles over things, and of course there's the vi vs emacs holy wars, etc, but I can't think of a single time where something so integral to the distribution has been such a matter of controversy across the community. >In cases like that you should not hate systemd, but on the guilty party introducing the bad dependency. This is clearly not systemd's fault. Oh, I'm not blaming systemd for this (Though it's not surprising Gnome has done this - the Freedesktop.org group is fairly incestuous when it comes to this sort of thing), I'm just saying it's pretty easy to say "Don't use systemd if you don't like it then!", but increasingly more difficult to actually do it. It's not like vi vs emacs or nginx vs apache where you can quite easily just use the one you want.

bkor 12y ago

> understand why Gnome, a desktop-environment running on top of X, maybe running on top of Linux, should make it self dependent on a Linux-specific component like systemd GNOME doesn't depend on systemd. See for instance a blogpost about it: http://blogs.gnome.org/ovitters/2013/09/25/gnome-and-logindsystemd-thoughts/ http://blogs.gnome.org/ovitters/2013/09/25/gnome-and-loginds.... GNOME wants either logind (systemd) or ConsoleKit (freedesktop.org, unmaintained). Calling people "guilty" is also not very constructive behaviour, IMO. Too emotional while you're already showing lack of knowledge about this subject.