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Murder pretty much means you don't belong in a polite society, especially in the first degree. Do you even know what 1st degree is? Do you really want that pers

Murder pretty much means you don't belong in a polite society, especially in the first degree. Do you even know what 1st degree is? Do you really want that person back out, ever? There are monsters in this world, they are human. Society is best served with them not being amongst it freely.

davidcbc 12y ago
The purpose of prison shouldn't be JUST punishment, but also (and more importantly) rehabilitation. Very few people are actually completely beyond reintegration into society. We need a prison system that is designed to teach prisoners how to effectively reintegrate with society and provides the mental help that they need instead of one that just perpetuates the cycle.
- infectoid 12y ago
  Completely agree. There seems to be much more focus on punishing people than changing them into productive members of society. Sure, there are cases where people will never be able to integrate and that can be dealt with. But there is so much cognitive surplus being wasted here. We need all hands on deck for the coming decades. We need to grow up.
DougWebb 12y ago
What about soldiers? They kill people too, with all of the careful planning that goes into 1st degree murder, and they even get training on how to do it. The only things that makes what they do not murder is the uniform and the orders from the government. (You might also include an ethical/moral basis for the orders, but that's arguably present in a lot of murder cases too.) Getting soldiers back into civilian life can be challenging, but no one questions that it's something we must try to do. People who are convicted of murder did what they did for many different reasons, and making a blanket statement that they're all monsters and should be denied even the chance to rejoin society is wrong. Sure, some of them are lost causes, but not all of them, and therefore we have to give all of them a chance at redemption.
- noonespecial 12y ago
  The difference with soldiers is that they usually don't want to.
  - sobkas 12y ago
    They don't want to do what? Be a solider? Kill? Follow orders? Wake up so early? And what happens when they want? A life sentence?
  - thatswrong0 12y ago
    Gang violence makes up most of the violent crime that happens in the United States - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States#Gang_activities http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States#Gang... - 48% in most jurisdictions and 90% in others. Who ends up in gangs? Children who grow up in broken neighborhoods and families http://www.ojjdp.gov/jjbulletin/9808/why.html http://www.ojjdp.gov/jjbulletin/9808/why.html I doubt that most people who commit violent crimes were violent people from birth. Most of them were probably forced into a lifestyle in which it is the norm. This is not to say that these people aren't accountable for their actions, but we should definitely understand that most of these people grew up in circumstances where violence was unavoidable and that instead of punishing them indiscriminately, we should try to actually 'correct' them in correctional facilities by healing them and trying to help them become functioning, productive members of society.
arg01 12y ago
I think something else worth pointing out is that even rehabilitation in the case that someone will never be let out of prison serves a purpose as it makes the prison more effective for those who will.

davidcbc 12y ago

The purpose of prison shouldn't be JUST punishment, but also (and more importantly) rehabilitation. Very few people are actually completely beyond reintegration into society. We need a prison system that is designed to teach prisoners how to effectively reintegrate with society and provides the mental help that they need instead of one that just perpetuates the cycle.

infectoid 12y ago
Completely agree. There seems to be much more focus on punishing people than changing them into productive members of society. Sure, there are cases where people will never be able to integrate and that can be dealt with. But there is so much cognitive surplus being wasted here. We need all hands on deck for the coming decades. We need to grow up.

DougWebb 12y ago

What about soldiers? They kill people too, with all of the careful planning that goes into 1st degree murder, and they even get training on how to do it. The only things that makes what they do not murder is the uniform and the orders from the government. (You might also include an ethical/moral basis for the orders, but that's arguably present in a lot of murder cases too.) Getting soldiers back into civilian life can be challenging, but no one questions that it's something we must try to do. People who are convicted of murder did what they did for many different reasons, and making a blanket statement that they're all monsters and should be denied even the chance to rejoin society is wrong. Sure, some of them are lost causes, but not all of them, and therefore we have to give all of them a chance at redemption.

noonespecial 12y ago
The difference with soldiers is that they usually don't want to.
- sobkas 12y ago
  They don't want to do what? Be a solider? Kill? Follow orders? Wake up so early? And what happens when they want? A life sentence?
- thatswrong0 12y ago
  Gang violence makes up most of the violent crime that happens in the United States - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States#Gang_activities http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States#Gang... - 48% in most jurisdictions and 90% in others. Who ends up in gangs? Children who grow up in broken neighborhoods and families http://www.ojjdp.gov/jjbulletin/9808/why.html http://www.ojjdp.gov/jjbulletin/9808/why.html I doubt that most people who commit violent crimes were violent people from birth. Most of them were probably forced into a lifestyle in which it is the norm. This is not to say that these people aren't accountable for their actions, but we should definitely understand that most of these people grew up in circumstances where violence was unavoidable and that instead of punishing them indiscriminately, we should try to actually 'correct' them in correctional facilities by healing them and trying to help them become functioning, productive members of society.

arg01 12y ago

I think something else worth pointing out is that even rehabilitation in the case that someone will never be let out of prison serves a purpose as it makes the prison more effective for those who will.