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As an American, I have no in-depth knowledge of UK law. Which law mandated this? (I'm actually asking for chapter and verse of the lawbook).

by pnathan 12y ago

danielweber 12y ago
This isn't especially British or anything. If you bring your American laptop into an American secure facility and plug it into a secure network, it then becomes part of the secure network, and you cannot take it back. You also shouldn't get anywhere near the secure network without being told about this. EDIT: By "secure" I mean "classified/secret/top secret"
- dmix 12y ago
  Source? Edit: so plugging your laptop into a secure network = access to classified information, therefore your property can be destroyed?
  - newaccountfool 12y ago
    You don't even need a source for that its common sense, if you want a source try to find the CIA/NSA/GCHQ employee handbook or whatever material they give to new users. Its the same idea that malware operators test out mobile malware in faraday cages so that the malware can't jump devices.
  - eob 12y ago
    Yep. You've signed many contracts agreeing to that by the time you're allowed to access anything secure. At a prior job, we used to joke about "TOP SECRET cupcakes": once you brought them into the SCIF, they could never be taken back out. While Snowden, WikiLeaks, and others are demonstrating that every country may be a leaky ship information wise, the scale of the USG information security apparatus is absolutely amazing, especially if you've also gotten to see how some smaller countries do it.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
    - walshemj 12y ago
      And as a visitor you must hand over all you electronic devices (which are locked away and given back to you on exit) before going beyond reception. Years ago I interviewed at hunting's (a List X arms manufacturer) and the interviews where done in a separate room adjacent to reception you never even went inside the plant.
- Swannie 12y ago
  Same in secure operating environments in Australia, too. And by secure I mean environments which may, or may not, have access to (or even information about) classified networks.
andyjohnson0 12y ago
I've been over this topic with ZenPro before [1] and there are no such laws. At best there are some government procedures and guidelines, but no laws. Based on his/her comments I suspect ZenPro is somewhat full of it and thinks he's still a spy. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7737493 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7737493
- ZenPro 12y ago
  Believe me, if I was a spy I would have more important things to worry about than bringing some reason to a debate on Hacker News. The intelligence community is staffed with literally millions of people who are not spies. TOP SECRET clearance for contractors in the USA alone are >1million This is the equivalent of me wandering into a debate on the Royal College of Physicians and try to argue the merits of certain healthcare policies. Let's take you at your assessment - I am a 'fake' spy. Haven't I, even as a fake, demonstrated a breadth of knowledge on the intelligence apparatus that you could only dream of? What exactly is it you think you are bringing to this discussion? As for there being no laws; are you just ignoring the posters that have worked in similar US, Australian and International departments who say exactly the same laws exist?
  - andyjohnson0 12y ago
    I was using "spy" as an informal shorthand for "member of the intelligence community". Perhaps "spook" would have conveyed this better. So no, I don't think you are an actual spy. I don't think you've "demonstrated a breadth of knowledge on the intelligence apparatus that you could only dream of" either.
    - ZenPro 12y ago
      Are you accusing the other posters who confirm similar laws in the USA and Australia of lying as well or do you concede that they exist? Shorthand for a member of the community is just 'analyst'. Spook/Spy is a pop culture reference to a very specific role in the intelligence community. To give you some context about the thing that you think you know about. >> The United States Intelligence Community (I.C.) is a federation of 17 separate United States government agencies that work separately and together to conduct intelligence activities considered necessary for the conduct of foreign relations and national security of the United States. It includes intelligence agencies, military intelligence, and civilian intelligence and analysis offices within federal executive departments. >> The Washington Post reported in 2010 that there were 1,271 government organizations and 1,931 private companies in 10,000 locations in the United States that are working on counterterrorism, homeland security, and intelligence, and that the intelligence community as a whole includes 854,000 people holding top-secret clearances. That is just the USA. That does not take in the 5 EYES Community (UK, CAN, NZ, AUS) or the rest of Europe (FR, DEU, IT, DK etc) And you think that none of these places legally destroy magnetic media that contains compromised classified information? Seriously. Are you on crack?

As an American, I have no in-depth knowledge of UK law. Which law mandated this? (I'm actually asking for chapter and verse of the lawbook).

by pnathan 12y ago

As an American, I have no in-depth knowledge of UK law. Which law mandated this? (I'm actually asking for chapter and verse of the lawbook).

danielweber 12y ago

This isn't especially British or anything. If you bring your American laptop into an American secure facility and plug it into a secure network, it then becomes part of the secure network, and you cannot take it back. You also shouldn't get anywhere near the secure network without being told about this. EDIT: By "secure" I mean "classified/secret/top secret"

dmix 12y ago
Source? Edit: so plugging your laptop into a secure network = access to classified information, therefore your property can be destroyed?
- newaccountfool 12y ago
  You don't even need a source for that its common sense, if you want a source try to find the CIA/NSA/GCHQ employee handbook or whatever material they give to new users. Its the same idea that malware operators test out mobile malware in faraday cages so that the malware can't jump devices.
- eob 12y ago
  Yep. You've signed many contracts agreeing to that by the time you're allowed to access anything secure. At a prior job, we used to joke about "TOP SECRET cupcakes": once you brought them into the SCIF, they could never be taken back out. While Snowden, WikiLeaks, and others are demonstrating that every country may be a leaky ship information wise, the scale of the USG information security apparatus is absolutely amazing, especially if you've also gotten to see how some smaller countries do it.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - walshemj 12y ago
    And as a visitor you must hand over all you electronic devices (which are locked away and given back to you on exit) before going beyond reception. Years ago I interviewed at hunting's (a List X arms manufacturer) and the interviews where done in a separate room adjacent to reception you never even went inside the plant.
Swannie 12y ago
Same in secure operating environments in Australia, too. And by secure I mean environments which may, or may not, have access to (or even information about) classified networks.

andyjohnson0 12y ago

I've been over this topic with ZenPro before [1] and there are no such laws. At best there are some government procedures and guidelines, but no laws. Based on his/her comments I suspect ZenPro is somewhat full of it and thinks he's still a spy. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7737493 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7737493

ZenPro 12y ago
Believe me, if I was a spy I would have more important things to worry about than bringing some reason to a debate on Hacker News. The intelligence community is staffed with literally millions of people who are not spies. TOP SECRET clearance for contractors in the USA alone are >1million This is the equivalent of me wandering into a debate on the Royal College of Physicians and try to argue the merits of certain healthcare policies. Let's take you at your assessment - I am a 'fake' spy. Haven't I, even as a fake, demonstrated a breadth of knowledge on the intelligence apparatus that you could only dream of? What exactly is it you think you are bringing to this discussion? As for there being no laws; are you just ignoring the posters that have worked in similar US, Australian and International departments who say exactly the same laws exist?
- andyjohnson0 12y ago
  I was using "spy" as an informal shorthand for "member of the intelligence community". Perhaps "spook" would have conveyed this better. So no, I don't think you are an actual spy. I don't think you've "demonstrated a breadth of knowledge on the intelligence apparatus that you could only dream of" either.
  - ZenPro 12y ago
    Are you accusing the other posters who confirm similar laws in the USA and Australia of lying as well or do you concede that they exist? Shorthand for a member of the community is just 'analyst'. Spook/Spy is a pop culture reference to a very specific role in the intelligence community. To give you some context about the thing that you think you know about. >> The United States Intelligence Community (I.C.) is a federation of 17 separate United States government agencies that work separately and together to conduct intelligence activities considered necessary for the conduct of foreign relations and national security of the United States. It includes intelligence agencies, military intelligence, and civilian intelligence and analysis offices within federal executive departments. >> The Washington Post reported in 2010 that there were 1,271 government organizations and 1,931 private companies in 10,000 locations in the United States that are working on counterterrorism, homeland security, and intelligence, and that the intelligence community as a whole includes 854,000 people holding top-secret clearances. That is just the USA. That does not take in the 5 EYES Community (UK, CAN, NZ, AUS) or the rest of Europe (FR, DEU, IT, DK etc) And you think that none of these places legally destroy magnetic media that contains compromised classified information? Seriously. Are you on crack?