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This has happened to me too. A client who bought ads on my site wanted the links pulled so as not to make Google mad. That Google would think me a spammer is ve

by toddh 12y ago

This has happened to me too. A client who bought ads on my site wanted the links pulled so as not to make Google mad. That Google would think me a spammer is very very broken.

jonknee 12y ago
If you were selling links Google isn't that far off...
- anon1385 12y ago
  So you're saying all ads are 'paid links', except I presume Adsense ads. That sounds fair and reasonable.
  - jonknee 12y ago
    No, but if you're selling something that transfers PageRank you are (in the eyes of Google) selling links. It's that simple. http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2013/02/a-reminder-about-selling-links.html http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2013/02/a-reminde... > Selling links (or entire advertorial pages with embedded links) that pass PageRank violates our quality guidelines, and Google does take action on such violations. It's an easy test: if the advertiser isn't OK with you not transferring PageRank you are selling a link and not advertising. It doesn't matter that it's good content or that it's not spammy (that just makes you the publisher feel OK about it), you're selling links.
    - lugg 12y ago
      This whole thing seems bizarre. Pagerank smells broken to me. You can't buy links, but you can if you do it from us. What a scam. If pagerank can't differentiate "blackhat" seo links from organic links it probably needs fixing. In regards to this article its a bit strange. Reading the email its pretty obvious how it went down: Company hires dodgy seo company who sets up a bunch of links Google detects it, sends out warning listing all links to their site Company mass emails every site owner with links pointing back at them I don't think they were really asking the links to be removed from the authors site at all, it was aimed at someone completely different. All they had to go by was the referrer and the link.
      - jonknee 12y ago
        > You can't buy links, but you can if you do it from us. What a scam. You seem to be confusing how Google's advertising work. You can't buy a page rank passing link from Google. Adwords and Adsense ads do not pass PageRank. No legitimate advertising does (for starters because they all want to track visits and send you through redirects, but also because it's usually injected remotely and not part of the page that can send PageRank).
        lugg 12y ago
        But that is my point what counts as legitimate advertising? Who decides whether a link is non passing advertising or not. Google is the gatekeeper here. They get to decide what links are "advertising" and what are naughty naughty black hat so. Are you saying that if the seo guys labeled their spam links as advertising it would be legit and google would just ignore the links? Now they are telling you how you should advertise as wellas which adworks are allowed to sell you links. Want to try some viral marketing where you dont tell the user it was advertising - just brand awareness and a link back? Oops no that's trying to mess with Page rank were going to flag your site. Its ludicrous. Look I know they're not out to hit the good guys and the spammy tactics of bh seo peeps is gross as hell but I dont think you can really draw a definite line here without collateral damage being inflicted which is what I think this article was trying to point out.
        jonknee 12y ago
        nofollow makes it extraordinarily easy to stay out of trouble with any type of advertising you can think of. If your SEO guys used nofollow on their spam links it would not matter if they were paid for links or not (they wouldn't have a positive SEO effect though and would be a waste).
- toddh 12y ago
  I'm selling complete ads, that certainly contain links, just like Google does. They are contained in posts clearly marked as sponsored posts. These are not link farms, spam, or payed links. Advertising should not be a crime.
  - Donzo 12y ago
    If you are selling "ads" that transfer PageRank, you are selling links. I do not care that you do this, but you should be aware of what you are doing.
    - toddh 12y ago
      My understanding is selling links is an SEO scam. Are my "ads" a SEO scam or are they real companies to trying to sell real products to real people? How can you conflate the two?
      - jonknee 12y ago
        Would your advertisers be fine with you adding nofollow? If so, do that and you're fine. If they aren't fine with nofollow you should realize that the other stuff is window dressing and you're really selling pretty links (which means watch out, Google is looking to penalize you). Real companies selling real products to real people get in trouble for scuzzy SEO all the time. JC Penny comes to mind. Or RapGenius (though they aren't even selling anything!). It's the techniques used that are the issue, not what is being promoted.
        toddh 12y ago
        Shouldn't we be talking content and not form? Let's say a reader of mine is searching for a job and my site has a new great job at Apple. Apple advertises on my site because it attracts a certain kind of person. Shouldn't that person be shown my ad because it's both timely and highly relevant? That the job is on my site is a valuable signal. I don't use an ad service, I place every single ad and I have done so since the start. I check every single link. I check every single ad. I personally talk with every single advertiser. It's not hard for me to imagine an algorithm that does similar sorts of calculations. Oh, this link goes to apple. I've heard of them before. It's for a job. Scalability Engineer seems to be a valid occupation. Looks OK to me. You are saying all such signals have no value and should be filtered by nofollow? In actuality I've not given nofollow much thought. I guess I may now. I've lived by the idea of creating quality content, being honest, and doing a good job, thinking Google will figure it out. That unfortunately doesn't seem to be the case. The irony in this age of targeting and personalization valuable signals are being lost.

by toddh 12y ago

This has happened to me too. A client who bought ads on my site wanted the links pulled so as not to make Google mad. That Google would think me a spammer is very very broken.

jonknee 12y ago

If you were selling links Google isn't that far off...

anon1385 12y ago
So you're saying all ads are 'paid links', except I presume Adsense ads. That sounds fair and reasonable.
- jonknee 12y ago
  No, but if you're selling something that transfers PageRank you are (in the eyes of Google) selling links. It's that simple. http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2013/02/a-reminder-about-selling-links.html http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2013/02/a-reminde... > Selling links (or entire advertorial pages with embedded links) that pass PageRank violates our quality guidelines, and Google does take action on such violations. It's an easy test: if the advertiser isn't OK with you not transferring PageRank you are selling a link and not advertising. It doesn't matter that it's good content or that it's not spammy (that just makes you the publisher feel OK about it), you're selling links.
  - lugg 12y ago
    This whole thing seems bizarre. Pagerank smells broken to me. You can't buy links, but you can if you do it from us. What a scam. If pagerank can't differentiate "blackhat" seo links from organic links it probably needs fixing. In regards to this article its a bit strange. Reading the email its pretty obvious how it went down: Company hires dodgy seo company who sets up a bunch of links Google detects it, sends out warning listing all links to their site Company mass emails every site owner with links pointing back at them I don't think they were really asking the links to be removed from the authors site at all, it was aimed at someone completely different. All they had to go by was the referrer and the link.
    - jonknee 12y ago
      > You can't buy links, but you can if you do it from us. What a scam. You seem to be confusing how Google's advertising work. You can't buy a page rank passing link from Google. Adwords and Adsense ads do not pass PageRank. No legitimate advertising does (for starters because they all want to track visits and send you through redirects, but also because it's usually injected remotely and not part of the page that can send PageRank).
      - lugg 12y ago
        But that is my point what counts as legitimate advertising? Who decides whether a link is non passing advertising or not. Google is the gatekeeper here. They get to decide what links are "advertising" and what are naughty naughty black hat so. Are you saying that if the seo guys labeled their spam links as advertising it would be legit and google would just ignore the links? Now they are telling you how you should advertise as wellas which adworks are allowed to sell you links. Want to try some viral marketing where you dont tell the user it was advertising - just brand awareness and a link back? Oops no that's trying to mess with Page rank were going to flag your site. Its ludicrous. Look I know they're not out to hit the good guys and the spammy tactics of bh seo peeps is gross as hell but I dont think you can really draw a definite line here without collateral damage being inflicted which is what I think this article was trying to point out.
        jonknee 12y ago
        nofollow makes it extraordinarily easy to stay out of trouble with any type of advertising you can think of. If your SEO guys used nofollow on their spam links it would not matter if they were paid for links or not (they wouldn't have a positive SEO effect though and would be a waste).
toddh 12y ago
I'm selling complete ads, that certainly contain links, just like Google does. They are contained in posts clearly marked as sponsored posts. These are not link farms, spam, or payed links. Advertising should not be a crime.
- Donzo 12y ago
  If you are selling "ads" that transfer PageRank, you are selling links. I do not care that you do this, but you should be aware of what you are doing.
  - toddh 12y ago
    My understanding is selling links is an SEO scam. Are my "ads" a SEO scam or are they real companies to trying to sell real products to real people? How can you conflate the two?
    - jonknee 12y ago
      Would your advertisers be fine with you adding nofollow? If so, do that and you're fine. If they aren't fine with nofollow you should realize that the other stuff is window dressing and you're really selling pretty links (which means watch out, Google is looking to penalize you). Real companies selling real products to real people get in trouble for scuzzy SEO all the time. JC Penny comes to mind. Or RapGenius (though they aren't even selling anything!). It's the techniques used that are the issue, not what is being promoted.
      - toddh 12y ago
        Shouldn't we be talking content and not form? Let's say a reader of mine is searching for a job and my site has a new great job at Apple. Apple advertises on my site because it attracts a certain kind of person. Shouldn't that person be shown my ad because it's both timely and highly relevant? That the job is on my site is a valuable signal. I don't use an ad service, I place every single ad and I have done so since the start. I check every single link. I check every single ad. I personally talk with every single advertiser. It's not hard for me to imagine an algorithm that does similar sorts of calculations. Oh, this link goes to apple. I've heard of them before. It's for a job. Scalability Engineer seems to be a valid occupation. Looks OK to me. You are saying all such signals have no value and should be filtered by nofollow? In actuality I've not given nofollow much thought. I guess I may now. I've lived by the idea of creating quality content, being honest, and doing a good job, thinking Google will figure it out. That unfortunately doesn't seem to be the case. The irony in this age of targeting and personalization valuable signals are being lost.