4 ms·

As an app developer I can tell you that the problem is that these people don't spend money (on software). So even though there are now many more android users t

by ido 12y ago

As an app developer I can tell you that the problem is that these people don't spend money (on software). So even though there are now many more android users than iOS ones (world wide) it's still not a very lucrative market.

cageface 12y ago
The iOS market isn't very lucrative anymore either for most devs. It's hard to get noticed these days if you're not one of the lucky few at the top. Increasingly apps are just one aspect of some larger business and not a source of revenue themselves. In this world reach is what counts.
- ido 12y ago
  That's because a huge % of devs produce really bad apps (like all those clones of flappy bird and 2048). Like web apps in '99 we've had this media propagated "app millionaire" myth bringing in loads of bandwagon jumpers trying (and mostly failing) to make a quick buck. Of course it really depends on what you're making as you say, but I can tell you from personal experience as well as from a lot of other people I know in the industry that there is a certain class of apps (e.g. High priced, high quality niche games) that are fairly lucrative for independent developers like myself and for which all these huge amounts of people using lowest end android devices are of little to no consequence. If you're making "whatsapp" it's a different story.
  - cageface 12y ago
    Sure there are still people making money but the successful indie dev is an increasingly endangered species and no longer plays a large enough role in the ecosystem to drive platform decisions. I say this as someone that would much rather see indie devs thrive.
- kalleboo 12y ago
  Even in the top 50, the paid app market on iOS is dire right now. All the money is in freemium.
  - ido 12y ago
    Mobile expanded like crazy these past few years, so yes while you are right that f2p generates somewhere well above %90 of revenue the remainder is still a lot of money, most likely more than the whole paid market was before f2p dominated. For an independent dev trying to "just" make a good living that can be more than enough, even if it's utterly uninteresting to the zyngas and kings do the world.
danieldk 12y ago
Do any of the App Stores allow regional prices? E.g., I can imagine that it is attractive to charge e.g. $3.99 for a game in the EU and US, but perhaps $.50 in China and India. The scale could make up for the difference. Besides that, I think the ad market for such regions should not be understated. Especially in emerging economies, lots of companies will be competing for mindshare, both national and international. Also, with respect to the Apple comment of the grandparent: I think that Apple has to do something at some point. Because it's not only that there are good budget smartphones now, but you can also get excellent cutting edge smartphones around $300-400, such as the Nexus 5 and the Moto X. An anecdote: but I was an iPhone user for 5 years, but when replacing my iPhone 4, the Nexus 4 was so much cheaper (299 Euro) than a new iPhone. And I don't feel I lost any functionality. In fact, I can do a lot of things I couldn't do before (attaching files from the e-mail app, forward notifications to desktop per PushBullet, assign different notification LED colors to different apps, etc.)
- ido 12y ago
  Yep in google play you can set exact prices for each currency (or let it do currency conversion automatically for you - your choice). On iOS you don't set a price directly but a price tier (e.g. Tier 1 $0.99, tier 2 is $1.99 etc) and apple controls the exact price of each tier in each country.
netcan 12y ago
I wonder what percentage of app developers are really that sensitive to app sales. Ad-supported and underpants gnome supported seem to be bigger categories. Users directly paying for mobile apps is like users directly paying for web apps, a smallish part of the overall game. IMO, the bones of the business case (beyond the sheer number of these devices) is here: “for a vast number of people in a vast number of countries, the cheap handset will be the first screen, and the only screen.” If you want to show these people what movies are playing, sell them flights, let them share videos, shop online, etc. Targeting these “low end” machines is the way to do it. App sales are a small part of the overall picture.
- icpmacdo 12y ago
  > underpants gnome supported What does this mean?
  - omni 12y ago
    I'm guessing this means apps from companies without any business model at all that are propped up entirely by VCs.
    - netcan 12y ago
      I meant all companies for which the relationship between making software and making money is complicated.
  - wycx 12y ago
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gnomes_plan.png http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gnomes_plan.png
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- ido 12y ago
  Well again, apps in general are a totally different market than games.

by ido 12y ago

cageface 12y ago

The iOS market isn't very lucrative anymore either for most devs. It's hard to get noticed these days if you're not one of the lucky few at the top. Increasingly apps are just one aspect of some larger business and not a source of revenue themselves. In this world reach is what counts.

ido 12y ago
That's because a huge % of devs produce really bad apps (like all those clones of flappy bird and 2048). Like web apps in '99 we've had this media propagated "app millionaire" myth bringing in loads of bandwagon jumpers trying (and mostly failing) to make a quick buck. Of course it really depends on what you're making as you say, but I can tell you from personal experience as well as from a lot of other people I know in the industry that there is a certain class of apps (e.g. High priced, high quality niche games) that are fairly lucrative for independent developers like myself and for which all these huge amounts of people using lowest end android devices are of little to no consequence. If you're making "whatsapp" it's a different story.
- cageface 12y ago
  Sure there are still people making money but the successful indie dev is an increasingly endangered species and no longer plays a large enough role in the ecosystem to drive platform decisions. I say this as someone that would much rather see indie devs thrive.
kalleboo 12y ago
Even in the top 50, the paid app market on iOS is dire right now. All the money is in freemium.
- ido 12y ago
  Mobile expanded like crazy these past few years, so yes while you are right that f2p generates somewhere well above %90 of revenue the remainder is still a lot of money, most likely more than the whole paid market was before f2p dominated. For an independent dev trying to "just" make a good living that can be more than enough, even if it's utterly uninteresting to the zyngas and kings do the world.

danieldk 12y ago

Do any of the App Stores allow regional prices? E.g., I can imagine that it is attractive to charge e.g. $3.99 for a game in the EU and US, but perhaps $.50 in China and India. The scale could make up for the difference. Besides that, I think the ad market for such regions should not be understated. Especially in emerging economies, lots of companies will be competing for mindshare, both national and international. Also, with respect to the Apple comment of the grandparent: I think that Apple has to do something at some point. Because it's not only that there are good budget smartphones now, but you can also get excellent cutting edge smartphones around $300-400, such as the Nexus 5 and the Moto X. An anecdote: but I was an iPhone user for 5 years, but when replacing my iPhone 4, the Nexus 4 was so much cheaper (299 Euro) than a new iPhone. And I don't feel I lost any functionality. In fact, I can do a lot of things I couldn't do before (attaching files from the e-mail app, forward notifications to desktop per PushBullet, assign different notification LED colors to different apps, etc.)

ido 12y ago
Yep in google play you can set exact prices for each currency (or let it do currency conversion automatically for you - your choice). On iOS you don't set a price directly but a price tier (e.g. Tier 1 $0.99, tier 2 is $1.99 etc) and apple controls the exact price of each tier in each country.

netcan 12y ago

I wonder what percentage of app developers are really that sensitive to app sales. Ad-supported and underpants gnome supported seem to be bigger categories. Users directly paying for mobile apps is like users directly paying for web apps, a smallish part of the overall game. IMO, the bones of the business case (beyond the sheer number of these devices) is here: “for a vast number of people in a vast number of countries, the cheap handset will be the first screen, and the only screen.” If you want to show these people what movies are playing, sell them flights, let them share videos, shop online, etc. Targeting these “low end” machines is the way to do it. App sales are a small part of the overall picture.

icpmacdo 12y ago
> underpants gnome supported What does this mean?
- omni 12y ago
  I'm guessing this means apps from companies without any business model at all that are propped up entirely by VCs.
  - netcan 12y ago
    I meant all companies for which the relationship between making software and making money is complicated.
- wycx 12y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gnomes_plan.png http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gnomes_plan.png
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
ido 12y ago
Well again, apps in general are a totally different market than games.