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This is wonderful! I have to wonder - why is it that it took so long to come up with such a simple idea for such an obvious problem? I'd like to blame it on t

by jmadsen 12y ago

This is wonderful! I have to wonder - why is it that it took so long to come up with such a simple idea for such an obvious problem? I'd like to blame it on the "get rich, web app startup" mentality, but really, that's a fairly recent thing. Perhaps this is a harder problem than it seems? Or is it true that all our new inventors are chasing riches?

atrus 12y ago
Many things are obvious once you've seen them done.
- jmadsen 12y ago
  I realize that, and know my comment sounds naive - but. We have people who study earthquakes, and gyroscopes, and nerve disorders. And we have the internet so they can all easily share ideas & research. Is this idea REALLY so "un-obvious"?
  - cshimmin 12y ago
    Do we have people who study all three?
    - TeMPOraL 12y ago
      It is, in my opinion, an obvious solution. Or at least it should be for anyone who took control theory classes (or learned it by itself). So I guess is that a/ people who know engineering don't know what medical problems are, and (more likely) b/ there's a long, long way from an idea to working product.
      - logicallee 12y ago
        Don't mean to put too fine a point on it, but could you give me any example of a consumer solution throughout history that you would not class as obvious? I'm wondering what your standards are.
      - Kluny 12y ago
        Ok, it was obvious, and now someone's done it. So what?
  - tonylemesmer 12y ago
    Be careful not to confuse "problems" with "solutions" (you saw my other comment :)
tonylemesmer 12y ago
It is wonderful isn't it? My opinion as a biomedical engineer is that there is a lack of exposure of these real problems because, really, how many people know someone with Parkinsons? But when companies like this solve them in such an elegant way they can appear pretty cool and dare I say "sexy". So its an obvious solution, but I wouldn't say its an obvious problem. The list of problems is probably huge and a forum for capable engineers and designers to browse and help solve them would be awesome.
- jmadsen 12y ago
  " forum for capable engineers and designers to browse and help solve them would be awesome." That is an awesome idea - it seems like I've seen/heard of something similar, but if not, I'm a web programmer who could bang that together rather quickly. Before I do, has anyone heard of an existing site/forum?
  - tonylemesmer 12y ago
    It sounds like an obvious solution doesn't it ;) ? The key to making this work would be an adequate capture of the context as well as a description of the problem. In the product design world we use "Personas" as a vehicle for packaging problems into descriptions of user needs. They give the user a demographic and allow the designer to imagine that person and how they might use a potential solution. This allows to designer to avoid imposing their own preconceptions or doubts onto the context or idea before it is even a mere wisp of a concept. If you can capture this in a spam free, usable and elegant website I reckon you'll be on to something. Not sure how you'd monetise the output, but then that's why I've never finished the 50 or so website projects I started.
    - jmadsen 12y ago
      not everything needs to be monetized :-) I'll look these comments & site over and discuss with friends a bit; obviously, creating a site is the easy part
  - hershel 12y ago
logicallee 12y ago
The idea is actually not simple, and as I've commented elsewhere it turns out it is actually worthy of patent protection, and this particular company couldn't have even brought to market without it. I know it seems incredible, but that is the reality. Moreover, if they had not gotten patent protection on it and then a grant (from how I read their email to me on this subject, included in my other comment), they wouldn't have even been able to finish developing it. If they hadn't developed it, but only described the idea, people would have probably thought they were nuts.
icegreentea 12y ago
Two things to consider: 1) They claim they tested 100 algorithms over 2 years before they settled on one to bring to market. That's pretty much the definition of 'harder than it looks'. 2) This product requires sufficient cheap, powerful, and small accelerometers, processors, batteries, and sensors. All of which have really only come together in the last 4-5 years. Any engineer who made the connection in the 90s might have at most whipped together a prototype before doing the calculations and realizing that that it just wasn't viable. Conceptually, it's simple. I've personally seen 2 senior year engineering student design projects that more or less do the same concept - do feedback control on the spoon. They even had -ok- looking prototype demos. You could look at their spoon vibrating less, and you could look at their metrics, and see their claims, but then you would really look at it, and think 'man, that 40% reduction in amplitude sure looks sweet, but does it actually do enough?'. I can straight up tell you that nearly all 'simple' ideas become retarded complicated when they moosh up against a human being (or mother nature...), and 'complicated' ideas become even worse.

by jmadsen 12y ago

atrus 12y ago

Many things are obvious once you've seen them done.

jmadsen 12y ago
I realize that, and know my comment sounds naive - but. We have people who study earthquakes, and gyroscopes, and nerve disorders. And we have the internet so they can all easily share ideas & research. Is this idea REALLY so "un-obvious"?
- cshimmin 12y ago
  Do we have people who study all three?
  - TeMPOraL 12y ago
    It is, in my opinion, an obvious solution. Or at least it should be for anyone who took control theory classes (or learned it by itself). So I guess is that a/ people who know engineering don't know what medical problems are, and (more likely) b/ there's a long, long way from an idea to working product.
    - logicallee 12y ago
      Don't mean to put too fine a point on it, but could you give me any example of a consumer solution throughout history that you would not class as obvious? I'm wondering what your standards are.
    - Kluny 12y ago
      Ok, it was obvious, and now someone's done it. So what?
- tonylemesmer 12y ago
  Be careful not to confuse "problems" with "solutions" (you saw my other comment :)

tonylemesmer 12y ago

It is wonderful isn't it? My opinion as a biomedical engineer is that there is a lack of exposure of these real problems because, really, how many people know someone with Parkinsons? But when companies like this solve them in such an elegant way they can appear pretty cool and dare I say "sexy". So its an obvious solution, but I wouldn't say its an obvious problem. The list of problems is probably huge and a forum for capable engineers and designers to browse and help solve them would be awesome.

jmadsen 12y ago
" forum for capable engineers and designers to browse and help solve them would be awesome." That is an awesome idea - it seems like I've seen/heard of something similar, but if not, I'm a web programmer who could bang that together rather quickly. Before I do, has anyone heard of an existing site/forum?
- tonylemesmer 12y ago
  It sounds like an obvious solution doesn't it ;) ? The key to making this work would be an adequate capture of the context as well as a description of the problem. In the product design world we use "Personas" as a vehicle for packaging problems into descriptions of user needs. They give the user a demographic and allow the designer to imagine that person and how they might use a potential solution. This allows to designer to avoid imposing their own preconceptions or doubts onto the context or idea before it is even a mere wisp of a concept. If you can capture this in a spam free, usable and elegant website I reckon you'll be on to something. Not sure how you'd monetise the output, but then that's why I've never finished the 50 or so website projects I started.
  - jmadsen 12y ago
    not everything needs to be monetized :-) I'll look these comments & site over and discuss with friends a bit; obviously, creating a site is the easy part
- hershel 12y ago

logicallee 12y ago

The idea is actually not simple, and as I've commented elsewhere it turns out it is actually worthy of patent protection, and this particular company couldn't have even brought to market without it. I know it seems incredible, but that is the reality. Moreover, if they had not gotten patent protection on it and then a grant (from how I read their email to me on this subject, included in my other comment), they wouldn't have even been able to finish developing it. If they hadn't developed it, but only described the idea, people would have probably thought they were nuts.

icegreentea 12y ago

Two things to consider: 1) They claim they tested 100 algorithms over 2 years before they settled on one to bring to market. That's pretty much the definition of 'harder than it looks'. 2) This product requires sufficient cheap, powerful, and small accelerometers, processors, batteries, and sensors. All of which have really only come together in the last 4-5 years. Any engineer who made the connection in the 90s might have at most whipped together a prototype before doing the calculations and realizing that that it just wasn't viable. Conceptually, it's simple. I've personally seen 2 senior year engineering student design projects that more or less do the same concept - do feedback control on the spoon. They even had -ok- looking prototype demos. You could look at their spoon vibrating less, and you could look at their metrics, and see their claims, but then you would really look at it, and think 'man, that 40% reduction in amplitude sure looks sweet, but does it actually do enough?'. I can straight up tell you that nearly all 'simple' ideas become retarded complicated when they moosh up against a human being (or mother nature...), and 'complicated' ideas become even worse.