4 ms·

No, they don't have a right to express racist attitudes and thats why if they did they would be dicks. Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to abuse and offe

No, they don't have a right to express racist attitudes and thats why if they did they would be dicks. Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to abuse and offend.

pyre 17y ago
I'll assume that you're not from the US and politely disagree with the Canadian/European attitude that you can institute social change by making certain types of speech illegal... (i.e. Holocaust denial is illegal -- well at least publishing material about it is -- in Canada because it was deemed to be speech that 'incites hatred') (i.e. Nazi memorabilia is illegal in Germany, as well as other European nations like France) I'll leave you with this little nugget though. Freedom of speech isn't really true freedom of speech if what you really mean is 'freedom to say only the things that I want to hear.'
- jacquesm 17y ago
  Freedom of speech in Europe is essentially dead as long as in the countries with royal houses you can't insult the royals and you can't state any falsehoods wrt to whatever happened in worldwar II. I'm all for documenting and educating, not for outlawing stupidity, no matter how long your toes. I think I'd rather have USA style free speech laws than the make-believe ones that we have here. You can keep the guns though.
  - ErrantX 17y ago
    > you can't insult the royals ?? living in the UK I have yet ot be lynched for calling the royal family pompous.. well.. ;) Also I think there is some confusion here on the difference between the statments: "It is my belief that...." and "It is a fact that...." One is covered in free speech, one is (rightly) restricted by all sorts of law (for example defamation when applicable to statements about people). Think about it - if we had the inherent right to tell people our ideas were fact when this is not established Your free to think what you want, and tell people that's what you think. But presenting beliefs as fact is a big no no. Right? :) (holocaust denial being illegal is, I agree, somewhat of an extreme case and I dont agree with it so much)
    - jacquesm 17y ago
      dutch example: http://www.trouw.nl/krantenarchief/2007/07/31/2306950/Boete_voor_belediging_van_koningin_Beatrix.html http://www.trouw.nl/krantenarchief/2007/07/31/2306950/Boete_... international situation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A8se_majest%C3%A9 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A8se_majest%C3%A9 In the UK such laws are also still in the books.
      - ErrantX 17y ago
        Thanks. Though I would point out (still gotta translate the dutch example to read it) that "insult" is probably a bit of a generalisation.
cema 17y ago
Yes it does, unless it is restricted (as it is in many places, online as well as offline).
- boundlessdreamz 17y ago
  Freedom of speech is not a right if it conflicts with the rights of others. That is what i believe in. Anyway comparing _why's actions to hate speech is just ridiculous.
  - ptomato 17y ago
    Ahh, so people suddenly have a right not to be offended now? I find this view of yours very offensive. Shut up.

No, they don't have a right to express racist attitudes and thats why if they did they would be dicks. Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom to abuse and offend.

pyre 17y ago

I'll assume that you're not from the US and politely disagree with the Canadian/European attitude that you can institute social change by making certain types of speech illegal... (i.e. Holocaust denial is illegal -- well at least publishing material about it is -- in Canada because it was deemed to be speech that 'incites hatred') (i.e. Nazi memorabilia is illegal in Germany, as well as other European nations like France) I'll leave you with this little nugget though. Freedom of speech isn't really true freedom of speech if what you really mean is 'freedom to say only the things that I want to hear.'

jacquesm 17y ago
Freedom of speech in Europe is essentially dead as long as in the countries with royal houses you can't insult the royals and you can't state any falsehoods wrt to whatever happened in worldwar II. I'm all for documenting and educating, not for outlawing stupidity, no matter how long your toes. I think I'd rather have USA style free speech laws than the make-believe ones that we have here. You can keep the guns though.
- ErrantX 17y ago
  > you can't insult the royals ?? living in the UK I have yet ot be lynched for calling the royal family pompous.. well.. ;) Also I think there is some confusion here on the difference between the statments: "It is my belief that...." and "It is a fact that...." One is covered in free speech, one is (rightly) restricted by all sorts of law (for example defamation when applicable to statements about people). Think about it - if we had the inherent right to tell people our ideas were fact when this is not established Your free to think what you want, and tell people that's what you think. But presenting beliefs as fact is a big no no. Right? :) (holocaust denial being illegal is, I agree, somewhat of an extreme case and I dont agree with it so much)
  - jacquesm 17y ago
    dutch example: http://www.trouw.nl/krantenarchief/2007/07/31/2306950/Boete_voor_belediging_van_koningin_Beatrix.html http://www.trouw.nl/krantenarchief/2007/07/31/2306950/Boete_... international situation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A8se_majest%C3%A9 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A8se_majest%C3%A9 In the UK such laws are also still in the books.
    - ErrantX 17y ago
      Thanks. Though I would point out (still gotta translate the dutch example to read it) that "insult" is probably a bit of a generalisation.

cema 17y ago

Yes it does, unless it is restricted (as it is in many places, online as well as offline).

boundlessdreamz 17y ago
Freedom of speech is not a right if it conflicts with the rights of others. That is what i believe in. Anyway comparing _why's actions to hate speech is just ridiculous.
- ptomato 17y ago
  Ahh, so people suddenly have a right not to be offended now? I find this view of yours very offensive. Shut up.