5 ms·

Are You Really Gluten-Intolerant? Maybe Not

48 points by growlix 12y ago

spindritf 12y ago
Carbs just can't catch a break lately. I wonder if we finally pinpointed the problems with modern western diet or will our kids in a few decades see this as another fad, same way we start to view low fat recommendations.
- VLM 12y ago
  The modern western diet is the fad, if you look at what it is, how long its been around, and what our biologically identical ancestors ate for a huge multiple of time longer than the modern western diet.
  - tlowrimore 12y ago
    I'm curious to know what the key differences are between the modern western diet and the diet of our ancestors. Are you primarily speaking to our consumption of processed foods? Also, what was the diet of our ancestors, and how was this information about our ancestral diet ascertained?
    - VLM 12y ago
      "Are you primarily speaking to our consumption of processed foods?" Primarily, although massive grain consumption is evolutionarily very recent, so that counts too. "Also, what was the diet of our ancestors, and how was this information about our ancestral diet ascertained?" Talk to the archeologists. However it doesn't require much research to determine very few people ate twinkies or drank coffee a thousand years ago. I would not recommend talking to public relations firms, or people collecting a paycheck from the food industry in general.
  - gph 12y ago
    >what our biologically identical ancestors ate for a huge multiple of time longer than the modern western diet. Why is there a belief that our ancestors had a singularly common diet? Humans have lived in all areas of the earth with vastly different diets. Some were high in fat, some were high in protein, some relied on plants/fruit, others were more balanced, etc. Yes we probably on average have a higher carb intake than most humans in the past. But that doesn't mean there was some standardized diet that all pre-historic humans ate. They ate whatever was around to survive.
    - kennystone 12y ago
      Many of the staples of the Western diet simply haven't been around for longer than 15,000 years (agriculture), many in fact less than 100 years (heavily processed foods). It's not about ancestors all eating the same thing; it's about the fact we've introduced tons of new things, some we can handle and some we can't (and it probably varies per person).
    - raverbashing 12y ago
      The issue is not much about what was there, it's what wasn't. Fruits, vegetables, meat of some form was pretty much distributed all around (yes, in different quantities, etc, still) And sure, the evolutionary pressures were huge. This seems to be the source of things like lactose tolerance (the default is intolerance)
      - dllthomas 12y ago
        "(the default is intolerance)" ... after childhood.
    - VLM 12y ago
      Its more of an exclusionary process. The modern western diet is mostly made of vegetable oils, caffeine containing leaves and beans, huge amounts of refined sugar, ridiculous quantities of grains, antibiotic infused meats, fruit juices, milks, fermented products, huge amounts of corn syrup. Its no great challenge to go to the store for groceries and come home with nothing not on the list above, yet almost none of it existed more than a couple centuries ago. I realize this is considered an incredibly controversial opinion; I assume "most people" strongly believe our ancestors in 8000 BC mostly ate McDonalds and drank MtDew for every meal.
chez17 12y ago
I love the anti-science bias of people against the gluten-free trend. You're telling me if an article came out that showed a study with a sample size of 37 people found that marijuana was incredibly harmful we would see the same "Marijuana confirmed to be incredibly harmful!" all over the internet? With the same certainty and intensity? Give me a break. There is a lot of nonsense in the gluten-free movement, there is no doubt about it. However I don't understand the hate it generates out of otherwise skeptical and rational people.
- zinxq 12y ago
  It is perpetually surprising to me how much other people feel it's their business what other people choose to eat.
  - coldpie 12y ago
    It is frustrating as someone who prepares food for others to have to deal with bullshit "food intolerances" like the current gluten-free fad. I could prepare a delicious meal for you, but I guess you've decided you're gluten intolerant (unless you've been diagnosed with Celiac by a doctor, you're not), so nevermind. Or the tasteless sorghum beer these types bring to parties. Food's a social thing. Placing nonsense limitations on what's allowed can really cramp social settings.
    - collyw 12y ago
      Agreed. I think I may have a gluten intolerance (my brother has been properly diagnosed, apparently its genetic, and other symptoms that have lead me to believe this, that you probably don't need the details of). I avoid wheat products given the choice, but I won't stop eating wheat products as A) I like them, B) I don't want to be one of the whiny "I can't eat this" crowd (who also seem to come out with crap like dust allergies, or smoke allergies - everyone sneezes at those).
    - jamesgeck0 12y ago
      Having stomachaches for a week because someone involved with food decided that I don't really have a heath problem is also pretty frustrating.
chris_mahan 12y ago
I went gluten-free 2 years ago and all my symptoms went away, I feel better, have lots of energy, etc. I did not take a test, but my (non-alternative) internal medicine doctor told me to go on the gluten free-diet after I explained (in gory details) my symptoms. Is the test really necessary then? Really?
- squidfood 12y ago
  Maybe not to you, but from a public health perspective it is important to understand what's going on. Also: if you learned that gluten in general could be on the menu again, but that you should avoid gluten products that also contain chemical X, wouldn't it make your life (or the life of people cooking for you) a bit easier?
  - chris_mahan 12y ago
    Perhaps, but it's another test I have to pay for, so. (health insurance may pay some, but I'll still have a bill in 3 months staring at me asking for money.)
- galvanist 12y ago
  On your gluten free diet, do you eat (in no particular order): apples, pears, peaches, milk, sugar, asparagus, Brussels sprouts, broccoli, garlic, avocado, cauliflower, mushrooms, and soft / fresh cheeses? Do you have any issues with them? They are identified as high FODMAP foods. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-1746.2009.06149.x/pdf http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-1746.2009....
  - chris_mahan 12y ago
    I do, and I have no issue with them. I eat lots of apples, sugar, broccoli, mushroom, and cheese. Daily. I eat goat yogurt (I like the taste better) but I eat some regular yogurt too. I typically don't drink milk (taste again) and eat almond and coconut milk instead. (Trader Joe's gets lots of my business) I eat very few processed food, canned food. I eat all fruit (except kiwi--i get irritable bumps on my tongue), meats, cheeses, vegetables, rice, potatoes, dairy products, wine, and non-beer, non whiskey alcohol. (Also, some Shoju is made from wheat, so I only drink those from sugar cane, potato, sweet potato, etc). I eat very little fried foods. (Although I won't pass up french fries on occasion).
rdtsc 12y ago
> The ingestion of gluten, a protein found in grains like wheat, rye, and barley, gives rise to antibodies that attack the small intestine. Is this something new? Growing up in a different country I don't remember _ever_ hearing about this. And here is a huge "Gluten free X" market, where X is just about everything. Does this sound odd or strange? Isn't gluten something people have been eating for a very long time now? And now we've evolved this strange sensitivity to it. So the idea is that it is these FODMAPs. Do we today end up eating more products with FODMAPs while before when baking bread it just didn't have that many of those? I feel the same is happening with allergies. I don't remember hearing much about allergies. I only knew one kid in my high-school who had asthma. But now I know a lot of people in this country that are allergic to all kind of things. Heck my wife is. I have become allergic to pollen in the spring (and it never bothered me as a kid). Anyway, it just seems very puzzling.
- d23 12y ago
  I've been having terrible stomach issues for about a year now. I went to a nutritionist who suggested a FODMAP elimination phase to try to identify the problem. Nothing seemed to help. I don't really know what to do now.
  - baldfat 12y ago
    Go to someone who is not a nutritionist :)
  - rdtsc 12y ago
    I am sorry to hear that. That sounds very frustrating. Maybe try a different doctor. Maybe keep a diary of what you eat. See if there is something in particular the make it worse. We had to do it for our kid to see if they are allergic to certain foods (since my wife is).
    - bane 12y ago
      Sometimes that doesn't work, allergens don't always trigger the same response, or the same severity of response with each exposure. It's sometimes just better to cut out a class of foods for a few weeks and see if that solves it. The reintroduce it to see if the symptoms return. Then cut out another (overlapping) class of foods and monitor symptoms. Start to narrow down. Sometimes the classes of food that, when cut out, eliminate the symptoms can be false positives as it's one particular food in the class, or one ingredient in the food. My sister-in-law is allergic to peach skins, but can eat peaches just fine. It took quite a few years to figure that out.
bake 12y ago
While gluten itself may or may not produce any ill effects for non-celiacs (likely not, it seems), it may regardless be a helpful signal of which foods to avoid for other reasons. Even if only adhered to leniently, a bias against gluten has been a great help in reducing the quantity of processed food I consume, the benefit of which I don’t think anyone currently denies.
- coldpie 12y ago
  Indeed. I wish those who embrace this fad would come to the realization that the health benefits come from avoiding huge carb-loads like donuts, bagels, etc. The benefits don't come from avoiding gluten.
- nathanm412 12y ago
  Yes, but you could certainly make an attempt to reduce processed foods instead of indirectly by avoiding gluten. There is plenty of processed food out there that doesn't rely on wheat, and the gluten free section of the grocery store is starting to look more and more processed every day.
  - bake 12y ago
    Absolutely -- you're spot on.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
tzs 12y ago
Regardless of whether or not gluten-intolerance is as widespread as some claim it is, I'd like to see a simple change to food labeling to make it easier for those who want to know what they are eating to find out: versioning on labels. The way it works now, I go to the supermarket. I see, say, a frozen spaghetti and meatball entree. I carefully read the long label to see if it has anything that makes me want to avoid it [1]. It passes. I buy it. I like it. Can I now just buy it again, without reading the label? Nope! Food companies like to tinker with their products to improve consumer satisfaction and to cut their costs and increase their profits, so I need to read the label again. If they put version information, such as a last change date, on the ingredient list I could then just glance at the date and see if it has changed since I last bought the item. This should be doable at almost zero cost to the food producers if it is phased in by making the switch to versioning on a given product the next time they are changing the label. [1] I have no known foods that I must avoid for medical reasons, but I have some admittedly irrational requirements. Some time when I was a kid, I decided for some reason to stop eating meats other than beef and pork. I have sometimes described myself as a lacto-ovo-bovo-porco vegetarian.
growlix 12y ago
FWIW, I submitted this article with the title "Gluten intolerance is likely FODMAP intolerance" because I wanted to avoid the condescending, linkbait title of the original article.
allannienhuis 12y ago
Shameless plug for my iPhone/ios app: http://isthatglutenfree.com http://isthatglutenfree.com The marketing website is way out of date, but the app is current, regularly updated (dedicated staff) and has the largest database of gluten-free brands and products available. The next release (out as soon as I can get it past the Apple gatekeepers) adds the ability to easily find NEW brands/products. If you've chosen to eat gluten-free you know that finding tasty gluten-free products can be a real challenge. I'm trying to help people that have already made the decision to eat gluten-free; I'm not trying to 'promote' the diet itself - any significant diet and health decisions really should be made in consultation with professionals. Would love to feel some HN love for my app :)

48 points by growlix 12y ago

Carbs just can't catch a break lately. I wonder if we finally pinpointed the problems with modern western diet or will our kids in a few decades see this as another fad, same way we start to view low fat recommendations.

VLM 12y ago
The modern western diet is the fad, if you look at what it is, how long its been around, and what our biologically identical ancestors ate for a huge multiple of time longer than the modern western diet.
- tlowrimore 12y ago
  I'm curious to know what the key differences are between the modern western diet and the diet of our ancestors. Are you primarily speaking to our consumption of processed foods? Also, what was the diet of our ancestors, and how was this information about our ancestral diet ascertained?
  - VLM 12y ago
    "Are you primarily speaking to our consumption of processed foods?" Primarily, although massive grain consumption is evolutionarily very recent, so that counts too. "Also, what was the diet of our ancestors, and how was this information about our ancestral diet ascertained?" Talk to the archeologists. However it doesn't require much research to determine very few people ate twinkies or drank coffee a thousand years ago. I would not recommend talking to public relations firms, or people collecting a paycheck from the food industry in general.
- gph 12y ago
  >what our biologically identical ancestors ate for a huge multiple of time longer than the modern western diet. Why is there a belief that our ancestors had a singularly common diet? Humans have lived in all areas of the earth with vastly different diets. Some were high in fat, some were high in protein, some relied on plants/fruit, others were more balanced, etc. Yes we probably on average have a higher carb intake than most humans in the past. But that doesn't mean there was some standardized diet that all pre-historic humans ate. They ate whatever was around to survive.
  - kennystone 12y ago
    Many of the staples of the Western diet simply haven't been around for longer than 15,000 years (agriculture), many in fact less than 100 years (heavily processed foods). It's not about ancestors all eating the same thing; it's about the fact we've introduced tons of new things, some we can handle and some we can't (and it probably varies per person).
  - raverbashing 12y ago
    The issue is not much about what was there, it's what wasn't. Fruits, vegetables, meat of some form was pretty much distributed all around (yes, in different quantities, etc, still) And sure, the evolutionary pressures were huge. This seems to be the source of things like lactose tolerance (the default is intolerance)
    - dllthomas 12y ago
      "(the default is intolerance)" ... after childhood.
  - VLM 12y ago
    Its more of an exclusionary process. The modern western diet is mostly made of vegetable oils, caffeine containing leaves and beans, huge amounts of refined sugar, ridiculous quantities of grains, antibiotic infused meats, fruit juices, milks, fermented products, huge amounts of corn syrup. Its no great challenge to go to the store for groceries and come home with nothing not on the list above, yet almost none of it existed more than a couple centuries ago. I realize this is considered an incredibly controversial opinion; I assume "most people" strongly believe our ancestors in 8000 BC mostly ate McDonalds and drank MtDew for every meal.

chez17 12y ago

I love the anti-science bias of people against the gluten-free trend. You're telling me if an article came out that showed a study with a sample size of 37 people found that marijuana was incredibly harmful we would see the same "Marijuana confirmed to be incredibly harmful!" all over the internet? With the same certainty and intensity? Give me a break. There is a lot of nonsense in the gluten-free movement, there is no doubt about it. However I don't understand the hate it generates out of otherwise skeptical and rational people.

zinxq 12y ago
It is perpetually surprising to me how much other people feel it's their business what other people choose to eat.
- coldpie 12y ago
  It is frustrating as someone who prepares food for others to have to deal with bullshit "food intolerances" like the current gluten-free fad. I could prepare a delicious meal for you, but I guess you've decided you're gluten intolerant (unless you've been diagnosed with Celiac by a doctor, you're not), so nevermind. Or the tasteless sorghum beer these types bring to parties. Food's a social thing. Placing nonsense limitations on what's allowed can really cramp social settings.
  - collyw 12y ago
    Agreed. I think I may have a gluten intolerance (my brother has been properly diagnosed, apparently its genetic, and other symptoms that have lead me to believe this, that you probably don't need the details of). I avoid wheat products given the choice, but I won't stop eating wheat products as A) I like them, B) I don't want to be one of the whiny "I can't eat this" crowd (who also seem to come out with crap like dust allergies, or smoke allergies - everyone sneezes at those).
  - jamesgeck0 12y ago
    Having stomachaches for a week because someone involved with food decided that I don't really have a heath problem is also pretty frustrating.

chris_mahan 12y ago

I went gluten-free 2 years ago and all my symptoms went away, I feel better, have lots of energy, etc. I did not take a test, but my (non-alternative) internal medicine doctor told me to go on the gluten free-diet after I explained (in gory details) my symptoms. Is the test really necessary then? Really?

squidfood 12y ago
Maybe not to you, but from a public health perspective it is important to understand what's going on. Also: if you learned that gluten in general could be on the menu again, but that you should avoid gluten products that also contain chemical X, wouldn't it make your life (or the life of people cooking for you) a bit easier?
- chris_mahan 12y ago
  Perhaps, but it's another test I have to pay for, so. (health insurance may pay some, but I'll still have a bill in 3 months staring at me asking for money.)
galvanist 12y ago
On your gluten free diet, do you eat (in no particular order): apples, pears, peaches, milk, sugar, asparagus, Brussels sprouts, broccoli, garlic, avocado, cauliflower, mushrooms, and soft / fresh cheeses? Do you have any issues with them? They are identified as high FODMAP foods. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-1746.2009.06149.x/pdf http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1440-1746.2009....
- chris_mahan 12y ago
  I do, and I have no issue with them. I eat lots of apples, sugar, broccoli, mushroom, and cheese. Daily. I eat goat yogurt (I like the taste better) but I eat some regular yogurt too. I typically don't drink milk (taste again) and eat almond and coconut milk instead. (Trader Joe's gets lots of my business) I eat very few processed food, canned food. I eat all fruit (except kiwi--i get irritable bumps on my tongue), meats, cheeses, vegetables, rice, potatoes, dairy products, wine, and non-beer, non whiskey alcohol. (Also, some Shoju is made from wheat, so I only drink those from sugar cane, potato, sweet potato, etc). I eat very little fried foods. (Although I won't pass up french fries on occasion).

rdtsc 12y ago

> The ingestion of gluten, a protein found in grains like wheat, rye, and barley, gives rise to antibodies that attack the small intestine. Is this something new? Growing up in a different country I don't remember _ever_ hearing about this. And here is a huge "Gluten free X" market, where X is just about everything. Does this sound odd or strange? Isn't gluten something people have been eating for a very long time now? And now we've evolved this strange sensitivity to it. So the idea is that it is these FODMAPs. Do we today end up eating more products with FODMAPs while before when baking bread it just didn't have that many of those? I feel the same is happening with allergies. I don't remember hearing much about allergies. I only knew one kid in my high-school who had asthma. But now I know a lot of people in this country that are allergic to all kind of things. Heck my wife is. I have become allergic to pollen in the spring (and it never bothered me as a kid). Anyway, it just seems very puzzling.

d23 12y ago
I've been having terrible stomach issues for about a year now. I went to a nutritionist who suggested a FODMAP elimination phase to try to identify the problem. Nothing seemed to help. I don't really know what to do now.
- baldfat 12y ago
  Go to someone who is not a nutritionist :)
- rdtsc 12y ago
  I am sorry to hear that. That sounds very frustrating. Maybe try a different doctor. Maybe keep a diary of what you eat. See if there is something in particular the make it worse. We had to do it for our kid to see if they are allergic to certain foods (since my wife is).
  - bane 12y ago
    Sometimes that doesn't work, allergens don't always trigger the same response, or the same severity of response with each exposure. It's sometimes just better to cut out a class of foods for a few weeks and see if that solves it. The reintroduce it to see if the symptoms return. Then cut out another (overlapping) class of foods and monitor symptoms. Start to narrow down. Sometimes the classes of food that, when cut out, eliminate the symptoms can be false positives as it's one particular food in the class, or one ingredient in the food. My sister-in-law is allergic to peach skins, but can eat peaches just fine. It took quite a few years to figure that out.

bake 12y ago

While gluten itself may or may not produce any ill effects for non-celiacs (likely not, it seems), it may regardless be a helpful signal of which foods to avoid for other reasons. Even if only adhered to leniently, a bias against gluten has been a great help in reducing the quantity of processed food I consume, the benefit of which I don’t think anyone currently denies.

coldpie 12y ago
Indeed. I wish those who embrace this fad would come to the realization that the health benefits come from avoiding huge carb-loads like donuts, bagels, etc. The benefits don't come from avoiding gluten.
nathanm412 12y ago
Yes, but you could certainly make an attempt to reduce processed foods instead of indirectly by avoiding gluten. There is plenty of processed food out there that doesn't rely on wheat, and the gluten free section of the grocery store is starting to look more and more processed every day.
- bake 12y ago
  Absolutely -- you're spot on.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

tzs 12y ago

Regardless of whether or not gluten-intolerance is as widespread as some claim it is, I'd like to see a simple change to food labeling to make it easier for those who want to know what they are eating to find out: versioning on labels. The way it works now, I go to the supermarket. I see, say, a frozen spaghetti and meatball entree. I carefully read the long label to see if it has anything that makes me want to avoid it [1]. It passes. I buy it. I like it. Can I now just buy it again, without reading the label? Nope! Food companies like to tinker with their products to improve consumer satisfaction and to cut their costs and increase their profits, so I need to read the label again. If they put version information, such as a last change date, on the ingredient list I could then just glance at the date and see if it has changed since I last bought the item. This should be doable at almost zero cost to the food producers if it is phased in by making the switch to versioning on a given product the next time they are changing the label. [1] I have no known foods that I must avoid for medical reasons, but I have some admittedly irrational requirements. Some time when I was a kid, I decided for some reason to stop eating meats other than beef and pork. I have sometimes described myself as a lacto-ovo-bovo-porco vegetarian.

growlix 12y ago

FWIW, I submitted this article with the title "Gluten intolerance is likely FODMAP intolerance" because I wanted to avoid the condescending, linkbait title of the original article.

allannienhuis 12y ago

Shameless plug for my iPhone/ios app: http://isthatglutenfree.com http://isthatglutenfree.com The marketing website is way out of date, but the app is current, regularly updated (dedicated staff) and has the largest database of gluten-free brands and products available. The next release (out as soon as I can get it past the Apple gatekeepers) adds the ability to easily find NEW brands/products. If you've chosen to eat gluten-free you know that finding tasty gluten-free products can be a real challenge. I'm trying to help people that have already made the decision to eat gluten-free; I'm not trying to 'promote' the diet itself - any significant diet and health decisions really should be made in consultation with professionals. Would love to feel some HN love for my app :)