5 ms·

If you build it, they will come – but they might hate you

1 points by reuven 12y ago

Jugurtha 12y ago
That kind of reaction isn't surprising from people taking an introductory class in Python. Meaning that if you are the kind of people who takes an introductory class in Python, with a teacher and all, you are not allowed to talk authoritatively on any software, since you probably didn't bother reading the doc of that software (remember, you're taking an introductory class in Python, with all the available, free, resources in that language). Furthermore, if a couple of days are enough to change your opinion on a piece of software, this means you haven't bothered really looking into that software, and had a childish reactionary judgement towards said software in the first place (if you learned what this software can do in two days, it means you learned more in two days than you already knew, which means you haven't looked into the software, really). So it depends. You can't please everyone, especially not people who dismiss stuff without even doing the minimum required reading. My bet would be that only a couple of people in that class really tried Git, and the others just echoed whatever they've heard about it just to seem "in the know".
- reuven 12y ago
  FYI, the people who were taking my intro Python class each had 10-20 years of professional experience as a C, C++, or Java developer. So we're not talking about people who are new to software, or to software engineering. I've been teaching Python (and Ruby, PostgreSQL, and Git) classes for many years now. When I teach such classes, I don't pretend that the information I'm giving them is secret or special. It's all available online, and for free, as you point out. My job, as I see it, is to give them context, insights, and exercises that will help them understand the technology in question faster than they could do on their own. (Hmm, sounds like a quote out of Vygotsky's theories of learning...) In the case of Git, my impression is that someone in the company's management said, "You guys are all experienced developers, and have used a number of version-control systems. Here's a cheat sheet for working with Git. Go!" And because no one had taken the time to gain some perspective or thoughts, they tried to use Git in the wrong way, and were frustrated by it. The thing is, I don't blame people who have a hard time understanding a piece of software. I blame the software for not being easier to understand and more accessible. So yes, all of these experienced engineers could have learned Git on their own, and that would have solved their problems. But they shouldn't have to do so, and they didn't do so. Now, given that I made some nice money teaching them Git, I'm not going to complain too much. But if Git were just a smidgen more usable, more people would embrace and use it, rather than expressing frustration and anger.
  - Jugurtha 12y ago
    Hi, reuven.. I am well aware these guys were experienced (obvious from your post). I am also well aware of the rationale that your job is getting them up to speed in a relatively short time (think diode current function, your job would be to drop them at the conduction voltage). My comment was that, there are some people, as bright as they may be, who dismiss things in a reactionary manner (which is what you said: someone probably gave them a cheat sheet, and they didn't bother looking further into it). My comment wasn't on competence, it was on intellectual laziness which takes the right from someone to speak about a certain topic, if he had not done his homework first. You only talk about things you know.

1 points by reuven 12y ago

That kind of reaction isn't surprising from people taking an introductory class in Python. Meaning that if you are the kind of people who takes an introductory class in Python, with a teacher and all, you are not allowed to talk authoritatively on any software, since you probably didn't bother reading the doc of that software (remember, you're taking an introductory class in Python, with all the available, free, resources in that language). Furthermore, if a couple of days are enough to change your opinion on a piece of software, this means you haven't bothered really looking into that software, and had a childish reactionary judgement towards said software in the first place (if you learned what this software can do in two days, it means you learned more in two days than you already knew, which means you haven't looked into the software, really). So it depends. You can't please everyone, especially not people who dismiss stuff without even doing the minimum required reading. My bet would be that only a couple of people in that class really tried Git, and the others just echoed whatever they've heard about it just to seem "in the know".

reuven 12y ago
FYI, the people who were taking my intro Python class each had 10-20 years of professional experience as a C, C++, or Java developer. So we're not talking about people who are new to software, or to software engineering. I've been teaching Python (and Ruby, PostgreSQL, and Git) classes for many years now. When I teach such classes, I don't pretend that the information I'm giving them is secret or special. It's all available online, and for free, as you point out. My job, as I see it, is to give them context, insights, and exercises that will help them understand the technology in question faster than they could do on their own. (Hmm, sounds like a quote out of Vygotsky's theories of learning...) In the case of Git, my impression is that someone in the company's management said, "You guys are all experienced developers, and have used a number of version-control systems. Here's a cheat sheet for working with Git. Go!" And because no one had taken the time to gain some perspective or thoughts, they tried to use Git in the wrong way, and were frustrated by it. The thing is, I don't blame people who have a hard time understanding a piece of software. I blame the software for not being easier to understand and more accessible. So yes, all of these experienced engineers could have learned Git on their own, and that would have solved their problems. But they shouldn't have to do so, and they didn't do so. Now, given that I made some nice money teaching them Git, I'm not going to complain too much. But if Git were just a smidgen more usable, more people would embrace and use it, rather than expressing frustration and anger.
- Jugurtha 12y ago
  Hi, reuven.. I am well aware these guys were experienced (obvious from your post). I am also well aware of the rationale that your job is getting them up to speed in a relatively short time (think diode current function, your job would be to drop them at the conduction voltage). My comment was that, there are some people, as bright as they may be, who dismiss things in a reactionary manner (which is what you said: someone probably gave them a cheat sheet, and they didn't bother looking further into it). My comment wasn't on competence, it was on intellectual laziness which takes the right from someone to speak about a certain topic, if he had not done his homework first. You only talk about things you know.