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There's some subtle things going on in that anecdote that are easy to miss. The meeting they were in was a very stressful one, in a very stressful era. The pe

There's some subtle things going on in that anecdote that are easy to miss. The meeting they were in was a very stressful one, in a very stressful era. The person who looked nervously at her to see her response was new to the group. Guessing based on his concern, he hadn't yet been "initiated" into a more casual relationship with the others in the room. He was still on a somewhat formal ground. The person who made the comment was cutting through the unspoken fog underlying the meeting, and no doubt was intentionally using blunt language to assist in that. She responded with mildly crude humor of her own to indicate not only that she wasn't taking offense, she appreciated the attempt to break through the unspoken fog. She was also bringing the new guy into the circle a bit. The speaker continued with crude humor to sort of close the scene out. What a screenwriter would call a "button". It also emphasized his original point- "Let's get past this posturing we've been doing. We know what the game really is here, we're normal people and we've been fighting for our own interests." That would be the end of that line of humor, since it had now served its purpose. The same approach would usually (but not always) be inappropriate in a meeting of new acquaintances, but this was a different case. This was an inner circle in a time of stress, bringing a new member a little closer in.

aasarava 13y ago
You're absolutely right that there is a lot of nuance in that particular situation, and you did a good job of breaking it down. But that's my point: Brad was taking a very big risk in thinking that Heidi was on the exact same page. And we know that other people, even trusted friends at times, can read situations very differently than we do. If Heidi was even slightly uncomfortable around Brad or, say, had been groped earlier that day -- things unbeknownst to Brad -- her reaction could have been quite different. I've been in situations where the relationships between coworkers have been misread. In one case, two women reported a male coworker to HR after he sent out an email that many people, including other women in the group, seemed to think was innocuous. So I'd hate for someone to read Roizen's post and think that that is the typical response to sexual jokes in the workplace. Even if everyone laughs in the moment, someone may walk away feeling ashamed. More to the point, if you're looking for a way to break the tension, you can probably find a way to do it without making a joke that could potentially make some uncomfortable.

aasarava 13y ago

You're absolutely right that there is a lot of nuance in that particular situation, and you did a good job of breaking it down. But that's my point: Brad was taking a very big risk in thinking that Heidi was on the exact same page. And we know that other people, even trusted friends at times, can read situations very differently than we do. If Heidi was even slightly uncomfortable around Brad or, say, had been groped earlier that day -- things unbeknownst to Brad -- her reaction could have been quite different. I've been in situations where the relationships between coworkers have been misread. In one case, two women reported a male coworker to HR after he sent out an email that many people, including other women in the group, seemed to think was innocuous. So I'd hate for someone to read Roizen's post and think that that is the typical response to sexual jokes in the workplace. Even if everyone laughs in the moment, someone may walk away feeling ashamed. More to the point, if you're looking for a way to break the tension, you can probably find a way to do it without making a joke that could potentially make some uncomfortable.