4 ms·

Microsoft is going to have to take a stand and make this the last XP patch (for anyone not paying for extended support like certain governments) forRealThisTime

Microsoft is going to have to take a stand and make this the last XP patch (for anyone not paying for extended support like certain governments) forRealThisTime if they ever want to move on. In this case, I can understand the reprieve, if only because it came like 20 days after the EOL. In fact, you almost wonder if this wasn't publicized until after the EOL in an attempt for malicious parties to do maximum damage. But this won't be the last hole. Others will exist and if Microsoft doesn't stop from now on, it won't disappear until web standards change to such an extent that all versions of IE that run on XP won't render modern sites at all. Kind of a good reason, in retrospect, to decouple the web browser from the OS, huh?

rbanffy 13y ago
> Microsoft is going to have to take a stand And risk having all those corporate drones move to Linux, Android, ChromeOS or anything non-Microsoft or, worse, Microsoft-hostile? Risk spawning a non-Microsoft ecosystem around vast IT-deficient corporations (any reasonably managed IT infrastructure has moved on long ago) that would undermine their other side businesses? They'll never do that.
- vacri 13y ago
  No other desktop is suitable for the enterprise desktop environment out-of-the-box. Much as Windows is maligned, OSX doesn't have the range of tools available for enterprise use, and free desktops still aren't quite there for regular users en masse.
  - rbanffy 13y ago
    There may be many Windows-specific functionalities missing, but it's certainly possible to work around those. Why do you think OSs like Ubuntu or Red Hat are not suitable to be used as enterprise desktops?
    - theg2 13y ago
      I worked with in the real world at a non tech focused company regularly struggle with WordPress, Twitter, and Email. Just because HN is tech focused doesn't mean everyone's coworkers are.
    - vacri 13y ago
      My housemate is a regular user (not power user) and a known potterer. He loves figuring things out and patching things together, and wanted to try a linux desktop, so I set him up with one. He didn't want me to help him out, as he wanted to find things out for himself, to try it without me coming in and 'just fixing it'. I watched him struggle for months, then he admitted defeat and went back to Windows. He still (theatrically) shivers if we discuss the topic. I've seen this experience is seen in the wider desktop space - the only time a free desktop is suitable for low support usage is when it's so locked down it's not really a proper desktop environment anymore; that locked down, it's more like an appliance. When something goes wrong with a free desktop, it's not just a matter of figuring out what went wrong, but which are the right steps to fix it. This error on Gnome, will this fix I found for Fedora work on Debian? Is the problem in Gnome desktop or in the distro? My colleague once had a problem with something in Ubuntu, and found that there were four different solutions depending on which of the last four releases were in use. When your changing releases are years apart (Windows) this is less of a problem than when they're 6 months apart. I was pleasantly surprised when I loaded up ubuntu 14.04 and saw that it looked the same as before. Note that I'm not in the enterprise environment, only that I've had to help a lot of people with changes from OS version to version, and understand the need for stability... which is a reason why the path Win8 took particularly puzzles me, given Microsoft's strong position in the business world. I think that the free desktops are getting there, but haven't quite arrived yet.
      - rbanffy 13y ago
        I have another anecdote for you. My mom, a 79 year-old retired tourist agency owner and occasional tour guide had a Windows machine. When I gave up on fighting viruses on her Windows XP machine, I moved her to a Mac running OS9. Then I set her up with an Ubuntu box. She does her upgrades through the GUI (after the machine prompts her), runs mostly Firefox, imports her photos into Shotwell, shares them with her friends (on e-mail - she doesn't like Facebook), writes letters (and mail the printed copies) and seems generally comfortable with that. She moved from Gnome 2 to Unity without thinking twice. She prefers Unity.
- dublinben 13y ago
  It's probably better for Microsoft if those companies did move to an operating system like RHEL. They can still sell Office 365 subscriptions, and don't have to be responsible for security patches any more.
- filmgirlcw 13y ago
  Except at a certain point, none of their products will work with XP and as they shift from perpetual to subscription licenses and service contracts, the value of a shop that hasn't paid in X years is disappearing all the time. Losing those customers might be a good thing, at least if urge can still retain some business. They gave the OS 13 years. Ask RedHat to do that. Or Google. (not even going to mention Apple for mass enterprise installations, that's not their target anyway). Moreover, Microsoft can still argue that it's cheaper to migrate to. New Windows than a brand new system. Or you know, try to offer a VMWare or Citrix style solution to cut down on machine/licensing costs.
jiggy2011 13y ago
I'm guessing that those still using XP after EOL are those who don't care about security.

rbanffy 13y ago

> Microsoft is going to have to take a stand And risk having all those corporate drones move to Linux, Android, ChromeOS or anything non-Microsoft or, worse, Microsoft-hostile? Risk spawning a non-Microsoft ecosystem around vast IT-deficient corporations (any reasonably managed IT infrastructure has moved on long ago) that would undermine their other side businesses? They'll never do that.

vacri 13y ago
No other desktop is suitable for the enterprise desktop environment out-of-the-box. Much as Windows is maligned, OSX doesn't have the range of tools available for enterprise use, and free desktops still aren't quite there for regular users en masse.
- rbanffy 13y ago
  There may be many Windows-specific functionalities missing, but it's certainly possible to work around those. Why do you think OSs like Ubuntu or Red Hat are not suitable to be used as enterprise desktops?
  - theg2 13y ago
    I worked with in the real world at a non tech focused company regularly struggle with WordPress, Twitter, and Email. Just because HN is tech focused doesn't mean everyone's coworkers are.
  - vacri 13y ago
    My housemate is a regular user (not power user) and a known potterer. He loves figuring things out and patching things together, and wanted to try a linux desktop, so I set him up with one. He didn't want me to help him out, as he wanted to find things out for himself, to try it without me coming in and 'just fixing it'. I watched him struggle for months, then he admitted defeat and went back to Windows. He still (theatrically) shivers if we discuss the topic. I've seen this experience is seen in the wider desktop space - the only time a free desktop is suitable for low support usage is when it's so locked down it's not really a proper desktop environment anymore; that locked down, it's more like an appliance. When something goes wrong with a free desktop, it's not just a matter of figuring out what went wrong, but which are the right steps to fix it. This error on Gnome, will this fix I found for Fedora work on Debian? Is the problem in Gnome desktop or in the distro? My colleague once had a problem with something in Ubuntu, and found that there were four different solutions depending on which of the last four releases were in use. When your changing releases are years apart (Windows) this is less of a problem than when they're 6 months apart. I was pleasantly surprised when I loaded up ubuntu 14.04 and saw that it looked the same as before. Note that I'm not in the enterprise environment, only that I've had to help a lot of people with changes from OS version to version, and understand the need for stability... which is a reason why the path Win8 took particularly puzzles me, given Microsoft's strong position in the business world. I think that the free desktops are getting there, but haven't quite arrived yet.
    - rbanffy 13y ago
      I have another anecdote for you. My mom, a 79 year-old retired tourist agency owner and occasional tour guide had a Windows machine. When I gave up on fighting viruses on her Windows XP machine, I moved her to a Mac running OS9. Then I set her up with an Ubuntu box. She does her upgrades through the GUI (after the machine prompts her), runs mostly Firefox, imports her photos into Shotwell, shares them with her friends (on e-mail - she doesn't like Facebook), writes letters (and mail the printed copies) and seems generally comfortable with that. She moved from Gnome 2 to Unity without thinking twice. She prefers Unity.
dublinben 13y ago
It's probably better for Microsoft if those companies did move to an operating system like RHEL. They can still sell Office 365 subscriptions, and don't have to be responsible for security patches any more.
filmgirlcw 13y ago
Except at a certain point, none of their products will work with XP and as they shift from perpetual to subscription licenses and service contracts, the value of a shop that hasn't paid in X years is disappearing all the time. Losing those customers might be a good thing, at least if urge can still retain some business. They gave the OS 13 years. Ask RedHat to do that. Or Google. (not even going to mention Apple for mass enterprise installations, that's not their target anyway). Moreover, Microsoft can still argue that it's cheaper to migrate to. New Windows than a brand new system. Or you know, try to offer a VMWare or Citrix style solution to cut down on machine/licensing costs.

jiggy2011 13y ago

I'm guessing that those still using XP after EOL are those who don't care about security.