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How a Florida kid’s “stupid app” saved his family’s home
- gdilla 12y agowhat a great story. chapeau, young michael. you are the unstartup!
- diminish 12y agoAs much as I like the story, those stories are like exceptional lotto millionaire stories which keep the app rush alive, despite growing stats that overwhelming majority of app entrepreneurs can't make enough for a living, just with one app. So other kids, don't put too much hope on the possibility that you could do the same. But it could help you land a nice job..
- jonny_eh 12y agoHe's not even making much money off this app. He needs to rebuild the app with a better monetization strategy so he — and Schlofman — can start making decent money off it. So even if you're a genius like this guy and make a killer app, it's not likely to make you much money.
- dpcx 12y ago"much money" and "decent money" are very different things, potentially. If he's helping pay his parents mortgage, he's making "much money".
- jonny_eh 12y agoI read that to mean his previous Club Penguin apps did that.
- moistgorilla 12y agoHe made a ton of money off of the first two apps. Enough to pay for his families housing and the education of himself and his sister. But I agree, the app market isn't too reliable for making money. I see much more opportunity for building your resume using the app market instead
- hanley 12y agoFrom what I could tell, he made most of his money on an app that was using a trademarked name from a video game, I'm surprised no one went after him for that.
- poopsintub 12y agoHe just gained experience programming apps. Give him time and he'll be better at monetization. 300k impressions a day should yeild over a 6-figure yearly salary.
- mikestew 12y ago> But it could help you land a nice job. That's the advice I give to aspiring app store millionaires: on average there's no money in the app store, but there's plenty of money to be made making apps for someone else. Throw something on the store that's above the level of flashlight app, and point to it when in contact with a potential employer. There is no ??? step, you just move straight to Step 4: Profit.
- sergiotapia 12y agoWhen there's a gold rush, you don't go out looking for gold. You sell the shovels. Tons of money to made building apps for someone else.
- FLUX-YOU 12y agoCan't be that easy. Maybe if the employer is looking to pay you 10 an hour.
- will_work4tears 12y agoWell, your resume has to pass the filters, you still gotta do several phone screen interviews (at least one hour long, technical one), three panel interviews, an all day technical interview, and a 6 month "paid" (sorry, below market value) trial period. Then you can get the job. The App only appears to help.
- yaeger 12y agoI feel the same about open source in general. People may think "If I write something and it gets enough attention, facebook or google might buy me out" or something to that effect. Basically a get rich quick kind of deal. You only have to write one! thing, cash a multi million dollar check and be set. While that may have happened in the past a couple of times, wanting to start an open source project just because of that possibility would be nearsighted. But starting such a project to promote oneself is not. It is a great addition to your CV. Something future employers can directly check up on.
- nsxwolf 12y agoI've been in the App Store since opening day and in all that time I have made a grand total of $26, far below what I've paid to be in the program. My wife is going to let me do one more app, and if it doesn't earn enough to break even, I am instructed to shut down operations. I am very impressed with and jealous of this kid's success.
- owenversteeg 12y agoSame story here, down to the dollar amount, except I was in the WP7 store. I say was because earning cents an hour wasn't a terribly attractive proposition.
- wtbob 12y agoOut of curiosity, what are your apps? I don't have any iOS devices--I'm just curious.
- yoshyosh 12y agoMost app entrepreneurs wouldnt go as far as he did w/ regards to marketing. I think that was a big takeaway in the difference of drive. Most stop at facebook ads not working if even that. Extrapolate that approach to problem solving and you start to see a big diff in this entrepreneurs approach compared to others. I agree that luck is involved but don't let that blind you from the other ways he set himself up for a better shot at that.
- habosa 12y agoTrue but there is enough money in apps to make it fun and worth it as a hobby. I make Android apps and while I had a big flop with a game my two non-game apps have made me a nice chunk of money. I enjoyed making them and there's enough money in it that I'm not wasting my time. Plus it helped me get my job.
- pnathan 12y agoIt's not precisely a lotto. He has resilience, horse sense about what people like, and evidently a very high capability of negotiation. While he did manage to hit some luck, he has some skills and capabilities which will take him far if the horse sense doesn't leave with the onset of fame.
- mattgreenrocks 12y agoWhat I love about this kid is that he admits it's a "stupid" app. If we could get a lot of SV to admit the same thing, perhaps we'd have a healthier culture. But no, it's business-y-fake-success-killing-it-bullshit all the way down.
- maaarghk 12y agoabsolutely what I came here to post, props to the kid for this. I am sick of companies like pretending like their app will "change the way people <whatever>". No it absolutely will not. It's a runaway success sexting app, or a runaway success "stupid game" - just admit it and I'll respect you more for it!
- mattgreenrocks 12y agoI recently saw Phacility's copy (company behind Phabricator code collab tool), and I tell everyone about it: "Phabricator, except you pay money for it." Actually, the entire Phabricator (http://phabricator.org/ http://phabricator.org/) site is so anti-business-y it's delicious. The bottom of the page links to Pokemon. I realize it's just it's own sort of marketing aimed at people like me, but it is worth pointing out.
- djulius 12y ago+1 for the starcraft races and the selection of Pokemon.
- elwell 12y agoHa, look at their pricing page: http://phacility.com/pricing/ http://phacility.com/pricing/
- danudey 12y agoMore Phabricator goodness: - When closing a ticket, you can choose 'Resolved', 'Invalid', 'Wontfix', or 'Spite'. - When choosing custom permissions for an object, you can choose allow/deny 'when the moon' 'is full'/'is waning'/'is waxing'/'is new'. - Submission buttons for text fields are sometimes 'Submit', and sometimes 'Clowncopterize' or 'Avast!' or something equally ridiculous.
- differentView 12y ago> His father lost his job, and in 2012 their family home was foreclosed on. > They had to move into a much smaller apartment, and at the age of 16, Sayman found himself in the strange situation of helping his parents make the mortgage payments on the new place. This part sounds strange to me.
- windsurfer 12y agoYou missed the phrase "He also started pitching in for his and his sister’s private school tuition." What kind of family, so obviously down in luck, would pay to have a member of their family go to a private school?
- jnbiche 12y agoA family zoned for a very low-performing school -- not uncommon in South Florida.
- windsurfer 12y agoI am from Canada, where such a thing is almost unheard of. Private school is considered a luxury. This is a culture I'm very much unfamiliar with. Thank you.
- shabadoop 12y agoAnd really, I've only ever seen rich kids with minor substance abuse problems get sent to private school.
- jnbiche 12y agoThat just tells me that you've never lived in a city with truly atrocious public schools like Detroit, Newark, or New Orleans. In those cities, any caring family who can beg, scrape or borrow the funds sends their kids to private schools, including most middle class families, and many poor families (off a combination of scholarship money and extended family contributions).
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- msandford 12y agoIs anyone else surprised by the quality of reporting from Pando on this one? I thought it was all SV link-bait but this reads like real, actual news.
- Swizec 12y agoYou know what, this is a wonderful age we live in. A 13 year old kid can make money off iOS apps, at 17 they can make serious money. When I was a kid the best I could do was have opensource stuff out there used by thousands of people. Personal gratification was high, but my wallet never got anything out of that, there just weren't any decent distribution channels for non-free stuff. And this was less than ten years ago. Kudos to the kid!
- hansy 12y agoA wonderful age indeed. I see building apps becoming the new "lemonade stand" for kids.
- anatari 12y agoNo doubt there is more opportunity today than before as the Internet has grown, but 15 years ago, I got my start as a young teenager selling shareware, which was quite common back then. I don't have any data on this right now, but I bet the economics of it was better back then for the little guy too because there was so little competition versus the millions of apps out there now. I made more money back then selling shareware than 99% of people do now selling apps.
- Swizec 12y ago
- ForHackernews 12y agoWhat a ridiculously overwrought writing style. This is why Pando is terrible: > Instead, it took sheer force of will and a refusal to back down to any of the obstacles he faced. That, and an unholy faith in the power of Google to answer his questions. Don't get me wrong, this kid is pretty awesome, and I'm happy for his success. But let's be serious: He got lucky with a silly fun app that caught on.
- sp332 12y agoLucky, yes. Hard-working, undoubtedly! And she was surprised that he trusted that Google has all the answers, that's all.
- josefresco 12y agoDid you even read the article? What I found most striking was the he didn't just "get lucky" ... he may have gotten lucky once but he had numerous setbacks that he had to overcome, and did so very creatively. From his creative Instagram marketing, to his deals to get a server, to his numerous app enhancements and rewrites to address problems, he's got a lot more than "luck" on his side. Your could argue the Flappy Birds guy got lucky, but this kid had multiple successes, setbacks and kept (and keeps) fighting to move to the next level.
- eldude 12y agoIt's pretty alarming that the net financial outcome of all his efforts and 4Snaps' popularity and success is not enough to even pay his private school tuition. No doubt the intangibles will transform his life (network, fame, Zuckerberg, experience, etc...), but as a commentary on the viability of the app store for monetary gain in games, it's pretty bleak. As a developer, it was wildly successful (can't overstate that enough). As an entrepreneur, it was a big failure. If, as an entrepreneur, you're jealous of his success, you need to reevaluate your priorities and consider a change of profession. Too much Silicon Valley navel-gazing here.
- hatu 12y agoI think of it as Google and Apples failure mostly. Current app stores are terrible for new app discovery. Even for games which used to be a lucrative market a couple of years ago there seems to be just a handful that take in most of the money - which causes Google and Apple to showcase them more hiding all the new interesting lesser known apps.
- simonlebon 12y agosounds like a drink! "Silicon Valley navel-gazing" Maybe "Silicon Valley navel-gazer" would be better.
- caffinatedmonk 12y agoDo you have any advice for kids who code? I am 14 years old and I started programming when I was 12. I primarily write open source software.
- luisivan 12y agoFocus on doing things that matter, not stupid apps/games. I started coding when I was 12 as well. Great age to start!
- ttty 12y ago"Never give up" and "believe it will work"!
- newobj 12y agoMake sure you have fun. (i.e. I offer the opposite advice of luisivan :)
- kirse 12y agoLog out of this website, turn away, and never come back. Assuming you want to keep your coding as natural, fun, and creative as possible. You likely don't have the awareness and wisdom yet to remain untarnished by the many garbage influences you'll find on a site like this. Keep doing your own thing and building confidence in exploring your own paths, because there's a whole world out there that's going to tell you how things should be done and what defines success (to them). They're even going to sound really smart and appear to be doing things right based on some metric for "success", but only you personally can figure that out for yourself. It'll be harder to wrestle with figuring out your values, but will be far more worth it in the end, always stay true to what you want to do. Once you build some confidence and consistent integrity in your values and your own life approach, then come back.
- d12345m 12y ago“[It] was the most stressful time of my whole life,” Sayman says. “It will help me as an adult in the future because I learned how to be [stressed]. Now I understand adults completely.” This quote makes me want to drop everything and walk off into the forest.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- MattGrommes 12y agoThe tone of this article is hilarious. Someone made an app, all by themselves! With no VC help! It's amazing! It wasn't that long ago that in the wreckage of the first .com bubble people could make websites, then apps, without millions in funding. This story is awesome, this kid is awesome, I wish stories like this weren't such "news".
- freditup 12y agoNeat to see the community and parental support a kid who's willing to go outside of the usual methods of learning (school) and do things on his own. Not a real fan of the article though, seems unnecessarily patronizing to me: "His braces give him a charming little lisp." Really?
- tomjakubowski 12y ago(perhaps? (= it '(a pun)))
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- cbhl 12y agoIt isn't clear from this article... is there an Android version of his app? Or is he iOS-only?
- jakebellacera 12y agoHonestly, this is cool. A lot of kids just sort of "stumble" into all of this and it's inspiring in a way.
- theycallmemorty 12y ago“I knew this was going to be a huge app. I knew it because my sister liked it before it even existed.” Must be wonderful to have a validated idea fall in your lap like that!