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I find it a great shame that literally a handful of independent individuals take on responsibility compensated at a minuscule fraction those that directly benef

by zhte415 13y ago

I find it a great shame that literally a handful of independent individuals take on responsibility compensated at a minuscule fraction those that directly benefit from it: ISPs, Certificate Providers (particularly certificate providers, absolving themselves of accountability for potential loss) and Hosting Providers.

QuantumChaos 13y ago
That's a consequence of being open source. All the main open source licenses mean that anyone would be able to use OpenSSL without paying a cent to the creators. Advocates of open source often claim that creators of open source software can make money by selling services to users, like consulting services. As this article (and others) describe, this approach also didn't work that well for the OpenSSL team.
- pyre 13y ago
  Another possibility is that CommercialSSL becomes a product that takes a page from the Oracle playbook and panders to selling to these large enterprises, with little care for the needs of smaller businesses.
- zhte415 13y ago
  Open source > indeed, I agree. My perspective is principally the harmony or conflict of the open source -ness of OpenSSL, and the Tragedy of the Commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons of all using a resource while few feeling the need to compensate. It is interesting that open source has often found solutions around this 'tragedy' - ownership (contributing or forking) vs access (using) - but I feel a shame that those that work hard towards creating a public good (OpenSSL) only receive recognition when things go wrong, while those that have criticised (the possibly competing consultancies, perhaps) have themselves not forked or recreated a better solution, as it seems having the ability, confidence or willingness to carry the risk to credibility (for a better solution), or knowingly taken advantage of an exploit, is more profitable than giving back. tl;dr I admire these Steves and other contributors very much, and wish they get what they deserve. I guess the world of Star Trek is still somewhat way off.
colechristensen 13y ago
I don't. I find no shame in people choosing to give something away without asking for compensation. I find no shame in an economy which contains a significant amount of resources given gratis by choice. I do find shame in the insistence that everyone who gets a whiff of usefulness of some creation owes the creator (or the descendants of the owner of the creation) a toll.
- 6cxs2hd6 13y ago
  Yes, but GP wasn't advocating some sort of Disneyesque intellectual property regime. On the contrary, GP is pointing out that a lot of big, rich companies and their investors have been freeloading off the volunteer work of these 2 guys. So it's a "shame" in the sense of being an unfortunate situation. It's not illegal. Maybe it's not even unethical. But it is a damn shame.
midas007 13y ago
As a creator and a consumer, I think one has to not resent giving away something. Don't expect compensation, but ask for it if it's necessary to accomplish something as a stretch goal up from free. Also, there is value derived from street cred and it's better than a résumé. https://github.com/steakknife https://github.com/steakknife

by zhte415 13y ago

QuantumChaos 13y ago

That's a consequence of being open source. All the main open source licenses mean that anyone would be able to use OpenSSL without paying a cent to the creators. Advocates of open source often claim that creators of open source software can make money by selling services to users, like consulting services. As this article (and others) describe, this approach also didn't work that well for the OpenSSL team.

pyre 13y ago
Another possibility is that CommercialSSL becomes a product that takes a page from the Oracle playbook and panders to selling to these large enterprises, with little care for the needs of smaller businesses.
zhte415 13y ago
Open source > indeed, I agree. My perspective is principally the harmony or conflict of the open source -ness of OpenSSL, and the Tragedy of the Commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons of all using a resource while few feeling the need to compensate. It is interesting that open source has often found solutions around this 'tragedy' - ownership (contributing or forking) vs access (using) - but I feel a shame that those that work hard towards creating a public good (OpenSSL) only receive recognition when things go wrong, while those that have criticised (the possibly competing consultancies, perhaps) have themselves not forked or recreated a better solution, as it seems having the ability, confidence or willingness to carry the risk to credibility (for a better solution), or knowingly taken advantage of an exploit, is more profitable than giving back. tl;dr I admire these Steves and other contributors very much, and wish they get what they deserve. I guess the world of Star Trek is still somewhat way off.

colechristensen 13y ago

I don't. I find no shame in people choosing to give something away without asking for compensation. I find no shame in an economy which contains a significant amount of resources given gratis by choice. I do find shame in the insistence that everyone who gets a whiff of usefulness of some creation owes the creator (or the descendants of the owner of the creation) a toll.

6cxs2hd6 13y ago
Yes, but GP wasn't advocating some sort of Disneyesque intellectual property regime. On the contrary, GP is pointing out that a lot of big, rich companies and their investors have been freeloading off the volunteer work of these 2 guys. So it's a "shame" in the sense of being an unfortunate situation. It's not illegal. Maybe it's not even unethical. But it is a damn shame.

midas007 13y ago

As a creator and a consumer, I think one has to not resent giving away something. Don't expect compensation, but ask for it if it's necessary to accomplish something as a stretch goal up from free. Also, there is value derived from street cred and it's better than a résumé. https://github.com/steakknife https://github.com/steakknife