4 ms·

where would this "renaissance" be taking place? The most popular languages are java and C...

by jesusmichael 12y ago

revscat 12y ago
Java just added lambdas.
- jesusmichael 12y ago
  lambdas in java extend the object model not destroy it. So I don't get your point.
- mpweiher 12y ago
  Smalltalk has had blocks since at least 1976.
angersock 12y ago
JavaScript has both beat for deployment base and developer population, I wager.
- jesusmichael 12y ago
  I very much doubt that since java, c and python are the basis of most CS programs.
- catshirt 12y ago
  in our bubble this may ring true but pretty much the whole rest of the world is running on Java and C
  - angersock 12y ago
    Erm, you're ignoring a little thing called "The Internet as Experienced By Millions".
    - catshirt 12y ago
      1. erm, you are ignoring a little thing called "embedded systems". 2. what is the crossover of internet-capable devices also running Java or C? like 100%? 3. you are only defending your assumption that there is a bigger install base, not a bigger developer base.
      - angersock 12y ago
        I'll give you embedded systems for deployment, but the number of embedded systems programmers is dwarfed by the number of web developers. The problem with the TIOBE index is that it also seems to factor in courses and services--I wonder if there is a straight-up developer census. That'd solve the question rather thoroughly. :)
        catshirt 12y ago
        embedded systems is not a defense that there are more C programmers than Javascript. it is a defense that Javascript does not have a larger install base. embedded systems + financial/government sectors + academia + video games + mobile apps (compared to simply "web development") is my defense against the notion that there are more Javascript developers.
mimighost 12y ago
Same confusion...I know there are bunch of open source projects built using FP became popular recently, like Storm. Still, as far as I know, the work horses in some of the biggest firms in the industry are those not-so-FP languages, like Java, C++ and Python. FP is very cool, but I think it has yet reached that far to be treated more seriously like those more mature ones, which represent not only the language itself, but also the ecosystem behind: tools, libraries and community.
nikatwork 12y ago
Renaissance means resurgence, not dominance. Re = again, naissance = birth. 10 years ago I would see the very occasional article about Lisp. Now FP discussion is everywhere. Whether it's being used in prod systems or not, FP is certainly gaining attention.
- jesusmichael 12y ago
  There's been a discussion of object vs functional for 30 years. I've yet to hear a compelling argument for one or the other, but OOP seems to be easier for more people to grasp since it strives to replicate the attributes/methods/inheritances of real world concepts/objects.

where would this "renaissance" be taking place? The most popular languages are java and C...

revscat 12y ago

Java just added lambdas.

jesusmichael 12y ago
lambdas in java extend the object model not destroy it. So I don't get your point.
mpweiher 12y ago
Smalltalk has had blocks since at least 1976.

angersock 12y ago

JavaScript has both beat for deployment base and developer population, I wager.

jesusmichael 12y ago
I very much doubt that since java, c and python are the basis of most CS programs.
catshirt 12y ago
in our bubble this may ring true but pretty much the whole rest of the world is running on Java and C
- angersock 12y ago
  Erm, you're ignoring a little thing called "The Internet as Experienced By Millions".
  - catshirt 12y ago
    1. erm, you are ignoring a little thing called "embedded systems". 2. what is the crossover of internet-capable devices also running Java or C? like 100%? 3. you are only defending your assumption that there is a bigger install base, not a bigger developer base.
    - angersock 12y ago
      I'll give you embedded systems for deployment, but the number of embedded systems programmers is dwarfed by the number of web developers. The problem with the TIOBE index is that it also seems to factor in courses and services--I wonder if there is a straight-up developer census. That'd solve the question rather thoroughly. :)
      - catshirt 12y ago
        embedded systems is not a defense that there are more C programmers than Javascript. it is a defense that Javascript does not have a larger install base. embedded systems + financial/government sectors + academia + video games + mobile apps (compared to simply "web development") is my defense against the notion that there are more Javascript developers.

mimighost 12y ago

Same confusion...I know there are bunch of open source projects built using FP became popular recently, like Storm. Still, as far as I know, the work horses in some of the biggest firms in the industry are those not-so-FP languages, like Java, C++ and Python. FP is very cool, but I think it has yet reached that far to be treated more seriously like those more mature ones, which represent not only the language itself, but also the ecosystem behind: tools, libraries and community.

nikatwork 12y ago

Renaissance means resurgence, not dominance. Re = again, naissance = birth. 10 years ago I would see the very occasional article about Lisp. Now FP discussion is everywhere. Whether it's being used in prod systems or not, FP is certainly gaining attention.

jesusmichael 12y ago
There's been a discussion of object vs functional for 30 years. I've yet to hear a compelling argument for one or the other, but OOP seems to be easier for more people to grasp since it strives to replicate the attributes/methods/inheritances of real world concepts/objects.