3 ms·

I work with a consulting firm, and while I do mostly private sector projects, I get stuck in DoD and DHS projects sometimes.... The DHS is a tremendously broke

by JPKab 13y ago

I work with a consulting firm, and while I do mostly private sector projects, I get stuck in DoD and DHS projects sometimes.... The DHS is a tremendously broken organization. It is bloated, wasteful, filled with overpaid middle management idiots, run by overpaid middle management idiots, and has a conservative (in a bad way) culture due to the politically biased security clearance process of the United States. (What I mean by that is the security clearance process weeds out left of center people. Peace Corps, attended school at Berkeley, smoked pot? Forget about it, you're out. Well, the smartest people often fit this profile. And they ain't at DHS) This article hits the nail on the head in one sense. The hiring process is broken for the Federal government, but so is the firing process. If you are a productive individual and you work in a place where lazy, late to arrive, early to leave, incompetent individuals are not only tolerated but promoted, why would you stay? If you do stay, why would you work hard? That's the US Federal gov't GS workforce, particularly the DoD and DHS, in a nutshell. TLDR: The Federal government is not only slow to hire, but because it doesn't fire, let alone identify incompetent and lazy shitbags, the Dead Sea effect is in constant overdrive with competent people.

at-fates-hands 13y ago
>>> If you are a productive individual and you work in a place where lazy, late to arrive, early to leave, incompetent individuals are not only tolerated but promoted, why would you stay? If you do stay, why would you work hard? That's the US Federal gov't GS workforce, particularly the DoD and DHS, in a nutshell. Annnnnnnnnnnnnnd pretty much every large corporation I've ever worked for. Most of the smartest people I know usually start their own companies, or work at smaller firms where they get lucrative work to maintain a nice upper six figure salary; doing what they really love to do without all the corporate entanglements. For example, I had a friend who worked at Thomson Reuters. After three years, he got fed up with the same scenario you pointed out. He started his own translation company (he's from Bulgaria and speaks 6 languages fluently) and now his biggest client? Oh yeah, its Thomson Reuters. He makes triple now running his own show as opposed to when he was working in the meat grinder.
watwut 13y ago
"politically biased security clearance process of the United States" Sounds interesting, have you links or can you described it in more details? I get smoke pot example, although not sure that it has left wing bias (right wing pot smoking is not that much lower - maybe they got caught less?)
- Balgair 13y ago
  Membership or expressed intent to be a member of the Communist Party of the USA will result in a rejection. It's a hold-over from the Cold War, but it's still there.[0] [0] I dunno, google it? Make sure to include the term 'executive order' though.
  - mpyne 13y ago
    This would only weed out approximately 0% of liberals in the modern U.S. though...
    - rdl 13y ago
      The greater levels of drug crime/drug crime prosecution in minority communities, leaving a documented criminal history involving drugs, is potentially a systematic form of discrimination against minorities in the hiring process. (You can get a DOD clearance while admitting to having used drugs, although it seriously complicates a law enforcement clearance unless it was very long ago. It can't be ongoing. Having gotten arrested for it makes it a whole lot worse, though, form what I've seen of the adjudication reports from DISCO, though. White people generally do not get arrested for small amounts of drugs; black people do.)
      - mpyne 13y ago
        Yes, that's a very good point, though having briefly worked HR for civil service I'd say the diversity "upcheck" would be more beneficial. It doesn't erase the systemic discriminatory factor from the difference in criminal records for the same offense, but it does try to address it in a systemic form. Of course, diversity initiatives simply covers hiring, not clearance adjudication. But there have certainly been many other areas of DoD where people with known criminal histories (to include felons) have made it to positions of responsibility, often to the amazement of the public. E.g. childcare workers at DoD bases, and even the civilian security forces at a grouping of Navy bases. Even diversity planning has to bow to "bona fide occupational qualification" though. If the position description requires you to have a record free of things like organized criminal activity, then diversity planning can't help you (though it can make it that much easier for minority groups with no such criminal record to make it in).

by JPKab 13y ago

at-fates-hands 13y ago

>>> If you are a productive individual and you work in a place where lazy, late to arrive, early to leave, incompetent individuals are not only tolerated but promoted, why would you stay? If you do stay, why would you work hard? That's the US Federal gov't GS workforce, particularly the DoD and DHS, in a nutshell. Annnnnnnnnnnnnnd pretty much every large corporation I've ever worked for. Most of the smartest people I know usually start their own companies, or work at smaller firms where they get lucrative work to maintain a nice upper six figure salary; doing what they really love to do without all the corporate entanglements. For example, I had a friend who worked at Thomson Reuters. After three years, he got fed up with the same scenario you pointed out. He started his own translation company (he's from Bulgaria and speaks 6 languages fluently) and now his biggest client? Oh yeah, its Thomson Reuters. He makes triple now running his own show as opposed to when he was working in the meat grinder.

watwut 13y ago

"politically biased security clearance process of the United States" Sounds interesting, have you links or can you described it in more details? I get smoke pot example, although not sure that it has left wing bias (right wing pot smoking is not that much lower - maybe they got caught less?)

Balgair 13y ago
Membership or expressed intent to be a member of the Communist Party of the USA will result in a rejection. It's a hold-over from the Cold War, but it's still there.[0] [0] I dunno, google it? Make sure to include the term 'executive order' though.
- mpyne 13y ago
  This would only weed out approximately 0% of liberals in the modern U.S. though...
  - rdl 13y ago
    The greater levels of drug crime/drug crime prosecution in minority communities, leaving a documented criminal history involving drugs, is potentially a systematic form of discrimination against minorities in the hiring process. (You can get a DOD clearance while admitting to having used drugs, although it seriously complicates a law enforcement clearance unless it was very long ago. It can't be ongoing. Having gotten arrested for it makes it a whole lot worse, though, form what I've seen of the adjudication reports from DISCO, though. White people generally do not get arrested for small amounts of drugs; black people do.)
    - mpyne 13y ago
      Yes, that's a very good point, though having briefly worked HR for civil service I'd say the diversity "upcheck" would be more beneficial. It doesn't erase the systemic discriminatory factor from the difference in criminal records for the same offense, but it does try to address it in a systemic form. Of course, diversity initiatives simply covers hiring, not clearance adjudication. But there have certainly been many other areas of DoD where people with known criminal histories (to include felons) have made it to positions of responsibility, often to the amazement of the public. E.g. childcare workers at DoD bases, and even the civilian security forces at a grouping of Navy bases. Even diversity planning has to bow to "bona fide occupational qualification" though. If the position description requires you to have a record free of things like organized criminal activity, then diversity planning can't help you (though it can make it that much easier for minority groups with no such criminal record to make it in).